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 A Corrierino Awareness Thread 
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"Truth isn't truth."

Trump's lawyers are about one klonopin away from invoking Heisenberg.


Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:38 pm
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Moving away from Trump for a minute, let's talk about this Boots Riley essay.

The optics aren't great, considering how you have one director of one of the two black-helmed films this summer attacking the other one (which also happened to have a slightly better BO). And given some of the similarity in the two films - involving black infiltration of white institutions - the rivalry may seem more competitive than it is.

But the fundamental flaw in Riley's piece isn't so much straight hater-ation as it is flawed ideology concerning the (naive, imo) leftist attitude surrounding law enforcement. The calls to not only reform the criminal justice system but to abolish it outright has gained traction among a hybrid of libertarian, anarchist and social justice circles. I'm sure that Boots was sufficiently incensed when Spike Lee directly questioned this dogma in his film. Saying that there is deeply embedded systemic racism throughout the criminal justice system is not the same thing as saying that the system itself is existentially designed to be racist and is therefore irredeemable and irreformable. Sad to say, the world unfortunately includes a percentage of sociopathic opportunists, within all communities, which will require the enforcement of rule of law. The anarchist "non-aggression contracts" notwithstanding, criminal accountability will remain to be a factor in every population as long as certain predators assume that they're smarter than everyone else.

The fundamental gist of Riley's article is that Lee's film is about a good police officer. For him, this is a blasphemous fiction. Even taking into account the number of elaborations, or indeed out-right fictions, in BlacKkKlansman, Riley doesn't even concede the original memoir because, in his logic, why should we believe a cop? Even his memoir was "published by a publisher that specializes in books written by cops". Riley's primary objection is that the film makes cops look like good guys (ie "makes the cops look like they care"), and compounds this suspicious implication by pointing out how Spike Lee was paid to make an ad campaign to help the NYPD "improve relations with minority communities". Because who on earth would want that? No, the police are the enemy, full stop, and any overtures to cooperation and negotiation with the enemy is proof of complicty. I suppose it never occurs to Boots that the vacuum created by black people eschewing the force will probably be filled by white supremacists, but all the better to self-fulfill the prophecy.

Speaking of fictions, let me take a couple of Riley's claims into account. He claims, with zero evidence, that Ron Stallworth was a "Cointelpro operative". For Boots, I'm sure that this is a legitimate appellation for any undercover police officer, but in point of fact, there was no documented Cointelpro operation in 1979 when the events took place. The sunlight of the 1975 Church Committee shuttered those efforts. Riley mentions the contemporary 1979 Greensboro Massacre, which did involve an ex-FBI Cointelpro informant working with the local police, but this is not proof of ongoing Cointelpro operations, and there's no evidence that Stallworth has ever worked directly for the FBI in any capacity.

But my biggest objection with Riley's arguments is that the film is "being put [sic] while Black Lives Matters is a discussion, and this is not coincidental." I'm at a loss to understand how BlacKkKlansman somehow is an impediment to the BLM discussion. The film, objectively, appears to value black life considerably. The montage of Charlottesville is clearly intended to call attention to the current danger of race-based violence in America today. The problem, according to Boots, is that not all police happen to be Klansmen.


Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:19 am
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Furthermore, BlacKkKlansman is a legitimately interesting film and Sorry to Bother You is self-satisfied garbage. (The more time passes the more I sour on it.)

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Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:25 am
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Macrology wrote:
Furthermore, BlacKkKlansman is a legitimately interesting film and Sorry to Bother You is self-satisfied garbage. (The more time passes the more I sour on it.)

Unfortunately, STBY only played one theater in my area in a blink of the eye, so I'll have to wait for it on another platform. I'm going to try not to let this (unnecessary, imo) beef influence my opinion of it.

I've been a fan of The Coup for over twenty years now, so I'm familiar enough that Boots is pretty hard-core in his politics that this isn't too surprising. I still find it petty though.


Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:33 am
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uh oh

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/19/dining/asia-argento-assault-jimmy-bennett.html

I'm not excusing this, I'm just hoping this isn't used as a cudgel by those looking to attack the rest of the MeToo movement.


Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:05 pm
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Since we're turning on the libs, I'll also throw in some shade for Ocasio-Cortez for shutting the press out of a "public" town hall.

Not understanding what "public" means, especially for a so-called socialist, is bad enough. Her excuse, to create a safe space for various victims and afflicted, is even worse. Suggesting that the press (again, in a "public" setting) poses an unsafe threat to participants of a town hall is just weaksauce at a time when we're supposed to be pushing back against allegations of the lugenpresse as the enemy of the people (or the "public").

I don't mind writing this off as a rookie mistake, but this attitude of dismissing this "non-story" is extremely irritating as well.


Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:54 pm
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Jinnistan wrote:
Not understanding what "public" means, especially for a so-called socialist, is bad enough. Her excuse, to create a safe space for various victims and afflicted, is even worse. Suggesting that the press (again, in a "public" setting) poses an unsafe threat to participants of a town hall is just weaksauce at a time when we're supposed to be pushing back against allegations of the lugenpresse as the enemy of the people (or the "public").


hurm, I guess I hadn't thought of that. I may one of those who wasn't too bothered assuming this doesn't become a habit with her. I took her reason at face value but I could see why some would see her exercising self-preservation (or will if, again, it becomes a habit).

she makes me hopeful but I also fear she's going to blow it 'cause she only has to be wrong once. I felt that with Sanders in 2015/16 although the stakes should be a lot lower here (she isn't even gunning for a Senate seat) so maybe I just gotta chill a bit.


Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:30 pm
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I looked into that story some, and AOC Tweeted that she barred the press from the event in order to make it a safe place for the local immigrants in the community to show up and speak out, which, considering the way ICE has been running amok lately, probably isn't a bad idea on the whole.

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Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:22 pm
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Janson! Shieldmaiden is wondering if you want to choose the next Class Trip (also BadLieutenant but I dunno if he's been around lately).


Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:32 pm
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
Janson! Shieldmaiden is wondering if you want to choose the next Class Trip (also BadLieutenant but I dunno if he's been around lately).
I haven't seen him post here in a couple of weeks now, I'm afraid...

:(

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Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:12 pm
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eh, he's probably busy (iirc he's a finance journalist?)


Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:27 pm
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I'm not gonna lie, I laughed.

and I hope this wraps up soon so I can stop feeling like a crazy person.


Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:30 pm
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Stu wrote:
I looked into that story some, and AOC Tweeted that she barred the press from the event in order to make it a safe place for the local immigrants in the community to show up and speak out, which, considering the way ICE has been running amok lately, probably isn't a bad idea on the whole.

Well, there's no reason why AOC couldn't have held a private event with the local immigrants in her community, although even this would be harder to justify after she (presumably) wins her public office.

It's still a weak excuse, and threatens to perpetuate the characterization of the press as a threat to the people, where the press' very presence (again in a "public" setting - we're not talking about randomly filming people in their homes) can be justified as a threat to public assembly. Arguably, this justification would have a chilling effect on any form of public protest, like those protests against ICE which frequently involve undocumented participants. And the hypocrisy is that AOC is likely unconcerned with those participants in Charlottesville who have been identified, due to press coverage, and endured consequences for that. This is the line where one can't expect anonymity in a public arena.

If anything, I suppose this could lead to a better point about facial recognition technology vs. privacy, especially since we've learned how inaccurate the technology currently is (specifically with minority and female faces). And let's say that ICE were to raid a public assembly, either a protest or town hall, in order to round up any likely undocumented participants. Given the seemingly rapid breakdown of political-civic norms in the country right now, this may not seem too shocking, but it would be unprecedented, and would involve a much greater threat to democracy than the press ever could.


Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:58 pm
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
eh, he's probably busy (iirc he's a finance journalist?)

Wouldn't it be hilarious if BL turned out to have been Michael Cohen this whole time?

Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
I'm not gonna lie, I laughed.

I thought it was funnier when Trump gave "such respect" to "brave man" Manafort for, I guess, only being a scumbag con-man felon rather than some kind of snitch.


Thu Aug 23, 2018 12:04 am
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Jinnistan wrote:
Wouldn't it be hilarious if BL turned out to have been Michael Cohen this whole time?



I maintain he's actually Stephen Dorff. No normal person knows that much about Cinecittà Neorealism.

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Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:53 am
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I guess the whitewashing of John McCain's legacy is unsurprising. I've been imbued with a lot of self-righteous leftist anger over the last few years to feel like partaking though I know making big disrespectful gestures online won't change much. I feel like someone like McCain couldn't get elected president by today's Republican base (ditto Romney) and in some ways that is something to mourn. although I don't see the Trump movement as staunch opponents of imperialist wars and supply-side economics either. or maybe some of them are. it's hard to tell. depends on what their conception of Trump is I guess.

Trump's "I like people who weren't captured" line always pissed me off though since it seemed less a critique of America's involvement in Vietnam and troop worship and more along the lines of "having bad things happen to you doesn't make you a strong person and maybe if you were stronger, you wouldn't let bad things happen to you". although it's a lot more likely Trump was just taking a cheap shot at a high-profile critic of his. but something like that shouldn't have surprised me. would did surprise me was how little damage it did to his support. hell, even McCain endorsed him (until the pussy tape) and would end up voting for many of Trump's policies (but not as often as most which I guess makes him a maverick).

like many, I've found this a solid tribute to the tension between McCain's authenticity and his political calculation, especially when the former is emphasized so often when speaking of his legacy.


Sun Aug 26, 2018 4:58 pm
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side note: was anyone else aware of this movie?

http://bostonreview.net/politics/errol-morris-interview-american-dharma


Sun Aug 26, 2018 8:14 pm
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
I guess the whitewashing of John McCain's legacy is unsurprising. I've been imbued with a lot of self-righteous leftist anger over the last few years to feel like partaking though I know making big disrespectful gestures online won't change much.

The sentimntalizing is predictable, and even a bit understandable. Part of this is due to Trump-contrast, part is normal human reaction.

Without trying to perfect McCain's flaws, I will say that I will always be intrigued at the hypothetical administration that he could have had, had he won in 2000. (That was where he lost the South Carolina primary because a Karl Rove-orchestrated robocall campaign implied McCain had fathered illegitimate black children.) There's no certainty on how McCain would have handled 9/11. He did have a notorious temper and affinity for military action. But would he have surrounded himself with Cheney/Rumsfeld types, who were already planning on using any pretext to invade Iraq? Or would he have been more open to listening to Richard Clarke and reading the summer CIA memos reported in Eichenwald's 500 Days? (If I agree with Trump on a single thing, it is that the Iraq invasion was the most profound injury to modern American integrity.)

And speaking of "self-righteous leftist anger", we should also note how it was exactly this "cry wolf" villifying of McCain/Romney that allowed Trump to pivot far past the point of decency, made immune by the cries of "worst person ever" in comparison. (And even if we concede that Obama was still the best candidate in the '08/'12 elections, we've continued to see, on both left and right, some rather extreme villifying of him as well.)

Personally, I will not easily forget someone with phantom bone spurs denigrating a POW, and I hope no one fails to remember the hours before McCain's death when Trump refused to comment on McCain until he was sure that he was cold first.


Mon Aug 27, 2018 12:43 am
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Jinnistan wrote:
And speaking of "self-righteous leftist anger", we should also note how it was exactly this "cry wolf" villifying of McCain/Romney that allowed Trump to pivot far past the point of decency, made immune by the cries of "worst person ever" in comparison. (And even if we concede that Obama was still the best candidate in the '08/'12 elections, we've continued to see, on both left and right, some rather extreme villifying of him as well.)


I think I already broke my promise: I made a post in social media how dancing on the graves of imperialists provides empty catharsis given how many people still in power advocate bombing/military intervention/etc (and how this will hold true once worse individuals like Henry Kissinger and Dick Cheney pass away) and now my friend's mom is not happy with me. 'cause even if I was saying "doing this is futile", I still straight-up referred to McCain as an imperialist so I'm probably an asshole (don't cry for me).

also I'd say I've soured on Obama's legacy in the way many Sanders supporters have. although watching his presidency in real-time, what problems he faced, the opposition he ran up against, the difficulties of enacting one's ambitions, the "balancing act" all statesmen must perform, the very real failings every human being has, etc. I hope has kept me from vilifying him too hard. mostly expressions of disappointment than anger. I don't doubt President Sanders would have disappointed me plenty as well. not that we'll ever know....


Mon Aug 27, 2018 1:02 am
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:

Ima try to catch this at TIFF next month. Will report back if/when I manage to see it.

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Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:48 am
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I want to think that venting this will make me feel better but I could just be looking for attention, who knows

my “actually, colonialism had many benefits including….” peer from waaaaay back is going to law school.

we both received treatment at the same mental health facility and it's fair to say he's made far better progress. I won’t deny that I find many, many, many of his beliefs anathema to mine, no matter how civil and polite he is in expressing them. I know that he has helped far more people and done far more positive things than I have (and maybe ever will) by being unafraid to go out in the world and refusing to let the world change those core beliefs and letting others make him feel inferior or the “wrong” sort of person. or feeling those things and pushing through regardless. it is something I have always been envious of, especially as I sit in my childhood bedroom, mired in self-doubt and anger and depression and too worried about being thought an ideologue or hypocrite.

I know those envious feelings only make me an awful, small person. and that anyone who thinks otherwise about me are the dumbest motherfuckers in the world. but what good what it do to attack those other people for that? absolutely none. they’re just trying to be kind.

I hope I'm not wishing this guy ill either, I'd be much more content to find ways to stop letting him take up so much space in my head.

(and I know I ought to go back to my mental health professionals but I have had less time to do so with my warehouse job. but even back then I would put up resistance to a lot of treatment so I can't be asking for help if I'm not gonna follow through)


Sun Sep 02, 2018 9:02 pm
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
I want to think that venting this will make me feel better but I could just be looking for attention, who knows

It occurred to me, Ox, that I'm not very familiar with your personal details, and I'm not sure if this is because I've forgotten earlier posts or whether you posted under a different name at one point.

The "colonial" thing is one of those troubling rationalizations that is irritating but I don't think that a lack of historical understanding amounts to a lack of empathy. It can in some cases, where the rationale is deliberately designed to mask less respectible feelings. There are so many variations on it - black people per capita have a higher standard of living in America so maybe the slave trade wasn't so bad; anti-Semitism was an important impetus to consolidate the communal bonds in the Diaspora; despite (possibly because) being built on a foundation of transcontinental slavery Western civilization is now the strongest champion of human rights in the world (we had to learn the hard way!), etc, etc. More often than not, I think it's a poor argument to credit atrocious behavior by citing its completely unintentional, sometimes diametrically opposite, side effects. There was a small controversy when Neil DeGrasse Tyson claimed that Columbus arriving in the New World was the "most important event in human history", but he was specific enough to avoid crediting any moral claim to the incident. "Important" =/= "good", rather than significance of impact and consequence. Likewise, one could say that the Chicxulub meteor was one of the most important events on the planet, despite the lack of enthusiasm from dinosaur voters.

Your friend reminds me of Nim from OT. He also, as I understand it, has a burgeoning career in law, and as a (purported) member of the Federalist Society, would fall on the more conservative part of the spectrum (I believe he called Scalia one of the most brilliant justices). Anyway, in this case, luckily not only do a sufficient number of OTers know Nim's real name, but there is sufficient preservation of his posting history to stultify his rise through the robes. In a way, that's a very chilling thought for all of us.


Tue Sep 04, 2018 6:53 am
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m'yeah. I'm just aching to put him out of my mind and let live. if that's the way he feels about that (and other things), then good for him. I just feel crappy 'cause I feel like these feelings mean I'm a spiteful partisan.

also, I'm not prone to posting a lot of personal details so I doubt it is because you've forgotten anything. I know this is the first time I've posted about a lot of the above problems.

I'm gonna be real with you though. a little while ago, in a moment of weakness, I decided to engage with him after he shared an article criticizing the expansion of abortion rights in CA. paraphrasing:

"if abortion is murder, what's the ideal punishment for a woman who has had or solicited an abortion?"
"leave it to the states."
"but what do you support?"
"some penalty, probably something similar to fetal homicide."
"imo you guys outta start thinking more about what legal shape these anti-abortion sentiments are going to take especially if the end goal is to outlaw abortion/overturn Roe v Wade. so we have a clearer picture what you guys are fighting for."
"you don't get to make those rules for me. I don't have to have all the answers. it's clear that neither do you."
"fine, I don't. but I'm still going to wonder what the next step is."
<conversation ended>

I'm just glad I was able to slip out of that within an afternoon and not over a whole weekend. and he's not wrong, I don't have all the answers. though I don't know if I was being unfair with that demand. and if y'all think I was, I'll be ok.

because Jesus help me if I do this again.


Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:44 am
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Quote:
To be clear, ours is not the popular “resistance” of the left. We want the administration to succeed and think that many of its policies have already made America safer and more prosperous.


Quote:
Don’t get me wrong. There are bright spots that the near-ceaseless negative coverage of the administration fails to capture: effective deregulation, historic tax reform, a more robust military and more.

But these successes have come despite — not because of — the president’s leadership style, which is impetuous, adversarial, petty and ineffective.




plus Trump is sure to get even more paranoid and reckless


Thu Sep 06, 2018 1:14 pm
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I'm still taking that anonymous insider with a grain of salt. The timing is a bit too suspect. Coming on the heels of Woodward's book, it seems almost like a calculated reassurance - "oh, sure, Trump's crazy, but don't worry, folks, we got this!". Plus it has the benefit of fueling the worst "deep state" suspicions.

Either way, my money's on Ivanka.


Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:33 am
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It reads like it was written by an adult and isn't in Comic Sans, so we can rule out the Kush.

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Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:16 am
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:

Watched this earlier today, and at least at the moment (I'm still chewing it over), I can't help but find it a little unsatisfying. Part of that is unavoidable, as we're living in a world that Bannon helped create and we don't have the benefit of time and distance to provide much comfort. But also I think there are instances where Morris calls out inconsistencies on Bannon's part (early on he questions how Bannon reconciles populism and anti-globalist sentiment with corporate deregulation), but doesn't appear to push him on it after Bannon dodges the question. In the Q&A after the movie, Morris talked about how troubling he found Bannon's reference to Emmanuel Macron as a "little Rothschild banker", but it's strange that's never brought up in the movie. Probably the most telling moments are when Bannon relates his ideas through movies, and infers lessons that seem completely at odds with the humanity underlying the ones he cites. Morris said he doesn't find Bannon's worldview coherent, and from the movie it does seem more an ethos than a consistent ideology, but I'm not sure he teases out its flaws and inconsistencies as shrewdly as he could have.

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Mon Sep 10, 2018 5:54 am
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Rock wrote:
Watched this earlier today, and at least at the moment (I'm still chewing it over), I can't help but find it a little unsatisfying. Part of that is unavoidable, as we're living in a world that Bannon helped create and we don't have the benefit of time and distance to provide much comfort. But also I think there are instances where Morris calls out inconsistencies on Bannon's part (early on he questions how Bannon reconciles populism and anti-globalist sentiment with corporate deregulation), but doesn't appear to push him on it after Bannon dodges the question. In the Q&A after the movie, Morris talked about how troubling he found Bannon's reference to Emmanuel Macron as a "little Rothschild banker", but it's strange that's never brought up in the movie. Probably the most telling moments are when Bannon relates his ideas through movies, and infers lessons that seem completely at odds with the humanity underlying the ones he cites. Morris said he doesn't find Bannon's worldview coherent, and from the movie it does seem more an ethos than a consistent ideology, but I'm not sure he teases out its flaws and inconsistencies as shrewdly as he could have.

I've only yet read Morris' remarks at the festival regarding the film. It's impossible to distance it at this point from the controversy surrounding Bannon's recent disinvitation from a New Yorker event, and a subsequent controversy over his being invited to one from The Economist. Morris was showered with similar controversy, which amounts to "why 'normalize' Steve Bannon with a platform?", which I feel that he handled very sensibly. Were Mr. Death or Robert McNamara "normalized" by Morris? "Giving a platform" does not, in itself, bestow legitimacy. Had, say, David Remnick allowed Bannon to advocate his ideology without challenging it, then that would be a disturbing issue of legitimizing his worldview. But we'll never know now. Morris made clear in his own comments that it is precisely because he finds Bannon's ideas of ethno-nationalism so disturbing and dangerous that they need to be interrogated, brought into light and examined, sooner rather than later as these ideas take root in democratic soil. The left in America has been flirting with a greater aversion to even examining toxic ideas, under the naive notion that their suppression will make them "go away". We shouldn't be so childish to believe this. Suppressing ideas, in many ways, has a way of making them more toxic, more dangerous, or at least lending them a presumption of incontestable danger. Instead, the ideas spouted and spread by Bannon need to be contested in order to be defeated. Silence will not save you.

But I can't judge the film (yet) on its execution of properly addressing Bannon's ideas. I would hope that ideas as fundamentally inane as ethnic exceptionalism are not difficult enough to demolish by any truly enlightened interlocuter.


Mon Sep 10, 2018 9:34 am
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My assumption was the letter being a team effort between a few top men. Guys like Pence, Kelly, McConnell, maybe Ryan.

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Mon Sep 10, 2018 9:41 am
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DaMU wrote:
My assumption was the letter being a team effort between a few top men. Guys like Pence, Kelly, McConnell, maybe Ryan.

Image


Mon Sep 10, 2018 10:21 am
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Top... men.

I mean, it's a (very) relative term.

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Mon Sep 10, 2018 10:34 am
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Sidebar, it always blows my mind that that's none other than Jek Porkins of Star Wars, and that my favorite role of his, long before I knew who he was, was as the voice of Maximillian Roivas in the immortal GC video game Eternal Darkness: Sanity's Requiem.


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Mon Sep 10, 2018 10:35 am
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Jinnistan wrote:
I've only yet read Morris' remarks at the festival regarding the film. It's impossible to distance it at this point from the controversy surrounding Bannon's recent disinvitation from a New Yorker event, and a subsequent controversy over his being invited to one from The Economist. Morris was showered with similar controversy, which amounts to "why 'normalize' Steve Bannon with a platform?", which I feel that he handled very sensibly. Were Mr. Death or Robert McNamara "normalized" by Morris? "Giving a platform" does not, in itself, bestow legitimacy. Had, say, David Remnick allowed Bannon to advocate his ideology without challenging it, then that would be a disturbing issue of legitimizing his worldview. But we'll never know now. Morris made clear in his own comments that it is precisely because he finds Bannon's ideas of ethno-nationalism so disturbing and dangerous that they need to be interrogated, brought into light and examined, sooner rather than later as these ideas take root in democratic soil. The left in America has been flirting with a greater aversion to even examining toxic ideas, under the naive notion that their suppression will make them "go away". We shouldn't be so childish to believe this. Suppressing ideas, in many ways, has a way of making them more toxic, more dangerous, or at least lending them a presumption of incontestable danger. Instead, the ideas spouted and spread by Bannon need to be contested in order to be defeated. Silence will not save you.

But I can't judge the film (yet) on its execution of properly addressing Bannon's ideas. I would hope that ideas as fundamentally inane as ethnic exceptionalism are not difficult enough to demolish by any truly enlightened interlocuter.

I don't think Morris' movie can be mistaken for legitimizing Bannon's views, and from the sound of Morris' answers during the Q&A, I suspect there was a fair bit that didn't make it into the movie. My frustration is that although Morris identifies flaws in Bannon's thinking, his willingness to let Bannon be indicted by his own words means that Morris doesn't "go in for the kill" at a lot of pretty choice moments. Perhaps that's inherent in his interview style (I've only seen a handful of his movies, and not the ones you cite specifically), but I'm not sure it was appropriate for this particular subject.

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Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:27 am
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Rock wrote:
My frustration is that although Morris identifies flaws in Bannon's thinking, his willingness to let Bannon be indicted by his own words means that Morris doesn't "go in for the kill" at a lot of pretty choice moments. Perhaps that's inherent in his interview style (I've only seen a handful of his movies, and not the ones you cite specifically), but I'm not sure it was appropriate for this particular subject.

That does tend to be his style. In many of his films, you never hear any of Morris' questions, or only very rarely. He's not like a Michael Moore, for example, who needs to get plenty of footage of himself. Morris prefers a careful intervention, leading and guiding the interview, but always wants the "money shot" (so to speak) to be his subject stepping into a rhetorical trap of their own making. Let them indict themselves. Morris has never felt the need to exclaim his personal judgment.


Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:38 am
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Olivia Munn says "Predator" colleagues shunned her after calling out sex offender:

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Olivia Munn says her "Predator" colleagues shunned her after she blew the whistle on Steven Wilder Striegel, a convicted sex offender who originally appeared in the film alongside her in a cut scene. Twentieth Century Fox pulled Striegel's scene from the film, which is set for release Friday, after Munn notified them about his history.

Despite director Shane Black's public apology, Munn said he never apologized to her personally.

The 38-year-old actress said she's hurt none of her co-stars checked in on her after the news. She said she was surprised to see her co-stars give Black, who knowingly cast Striegel in spite of his past, a standing ovation at the film's premiere at the Toronto Film Festival.

She told Vanity Fair, "I looked back and I see the guys standing up, and I was just confused because I hadn't heard from them during the day. Everybody else was sitting down — it wasn't like this massive standing ovation for him. I felt it was still appropriate to clap and cheer, but to actually make that gesture to stand up, especially in this moment ... and privately I knew that no one reached out to me to say, 'Are you O.K.?' It did feel bad."

Munn said she felt as though she was being treated like the wrongdoer.

"I kind of feel like I'm the one going to jail," said the actress. "I didn't go to jail, I didn't put this guy on our set. I had this scene deleted. Thank God, honestly, that there is social media. It's the fans and news outlets that's confirming it to me that what I did was the right thing. If I didn't have that feedback, I'd kind of go a little crazy thinking, Why am I being treated like this? That's not O.K., to feel like the bad guy."

She also said she was disappointed that though she encouraged her cast mates to make a public statement to the Los Angeles Times about the issue, they did not.

"I wanted them to not be blindsided the way I was blindsided, and I encouraged them to put out a statement once the L.A. Times reached out to us," Munn said. "I was surprised that none of them did... There will be people in Time's Up who aren't really down with the cause."

The Los Angeles Times reports that Munn learned last month that Striegel is a registered sex offender who pleaded guilty in 2010 to attempting to lure a 14-year-old female into a sexual relationship via the internet. Munn alerted Fox on Aug. 15, and studio executives moved to cut him from the film.

In a series of tweets, her co-star Sterling K. Brown said he's sorry Munn felt alone in speaking about the issue. He pointed out that he was not at the premiere. "I hope you don't feel quite so alone. You did the right thing," he tweeted.

A representative for Munn's co-star Keegan-Michael Key said in a statement that Key did indeed reach out to Munn privately, saying, "Keegan reached out to Olivia privately last week to let her know how proud he was of her and echoed that sentiment in many interviews since then."

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Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:28 pm
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I hope I can get enough out of the excerpts from that Woodward book so I don't have to actually read it. I know we are living in abnormal times shaped by an abnormal individual but I just don't know what it's going to tell me that I don't already know from reading the news (i.e. not specific events but the overall "gist" of the Trump presidency).

and I'm sure you all saw his Puerto Rico death toll truther statement. I'm not surprised and yet I still have to remind myself that this isn't normal.


Fri Sep 14, 2018 1:08 am
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
I hope I can get enough out of the excerpts from that Woodward book so I don't have to actually read it. I know we are living in abnormal times shaped by an abnormal individual but I just don't know what it's going to tell me that I don't already know from reading the news (i.e. not specific events but the overall "gist" of the Trump presidency).

I have it, had to get it honestly. I'll be reading it over the next couple of weeks when I have the time. I like to see a compact frame of the facts that a more comprehensive book can provide over the more scattered, attention-span juggling, daily news coverage. Especially when dealing with such complicated issues - although it doesn't appear yet that Woodward's book has much to do with the Mueller investigation, I did find that reading something as already outdated as the Isikoff/Corn Russian Roulette book was helpful in orienting a number of disparate facts that I've seen over the past year and a half, many which have largely been lost in the stream of regular revelation, collected in one place under a common frame. The index of interested parties in this story spans so many countries and decades that it demands to be concentrated and simplified. The value of a single book is in how it concentrates a number of strains which have been scattered through months and months of coverage.

Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
and I'm sure you all saw his Puerto Rico death toll truther statement. I'm not surprised and yet I still have to remind myself that this isn't normal.

The fact that anyone still finds him to have credible estimates of any aspeect of reality is the only abnormality that truly depresses me.


Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:10 am
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Jinnistan wrote:
I like to see a compact frame of the facts that a more comprehensive book can provide over the more scattered, attention-span juggling, daily news coverage. Especially when dealing with such complicated issues - although it doesn't appear yet that Woodward's book has much to do with the Mueller investigation, I did find that reading something as already outdated as the Isikoff/Corn Russian Roulette book was helpful in orienting a number of disparate facts that I've seen over the past year and a half, many which have largely been lost in the stream of regular revelation, collected in one place under a common frame. The index of interested parties in this story spans so many countries and decades that it demands to be concentrated and simplified. The value of a single book is in how it concentrates a number of strains which have been scattered through months and months of coverage.


true....

I could build up a tolerance for this stuff and if I do, it will always be waiting for me at the library. at least it is more reputable than the Wolff book.

and as long as I'm not reading it just so I can feed my Trump hate-boner.


Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:22 pm
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
as long as I'm not reading it just so I can feed my Trump hate-boner.

I think I can safely say that my hate for Trump is decidedly unerotic. In fact, I kind of hate him precisely because I believe he's got the biggest hate-boner of them all, the toxic cocktail of hate and narcissism being his own powerful recipe of Cialis. Whenever he goes off on Hillary, the NFL, Sessions, etc, he seems so virily enthused. It's frankly god damn sickening. I want Trump impeached, first and foremost, so I don't need to exercise an hour or two of yogi-caliber concentration to keep him out of my head long enough to enjoy my business.

I have a boner for the day in which I will never have to think about Trump ever again.


Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:05 pm
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this is more about trying to convince myself that I don't have Trump Derangement Syndrome. or that if I do, that I can control it dammit.


Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:26 pm
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Oxnard Montalvo wrote:
this is more about trying to convince myself that I don't have Trump Derangement Syndrome. or that if I do, that I can control it dammit.

Let me help you out with that. You don't have Trump Derangement Syndrome. How do I know? Because Trump Derangement Syndrome is a bullshit diagnosis by compulsive gaslighters.

The last couple of times that I'v heard Trump Derangement Syndrome used in some kind of quasi-respectible sense was 1) Rand Paul, accusing Bernie Sanders of wanting to start WWIII with Russia (hint: Sanders had only introduced a resolution to disclose what Trump and Putin discussed at Helsinki), and this "Dr." Gina Loudon, who recently got caught lying about having a PHD in psychology (she does not, she has a degree in something redundantly called "organizational systems" which seems to only be offered by a single school) after publishing a book proving, using her fool-proof psychological theories, that Trump is actually the sanest president that ever lived. Why do we think Trump is so crazy? Because we're all suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome, says the totally qualified (fingers crossed) shill on Hannity.

Oh, there's derangement afoot, don't get me wrong. I advise that you stop believing people with zero credibility as your first remedy.


Sun Sep 16, 2018 1:19 pm
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Jinnistan wrote:
That does tend to be his style. In many of his films, you never hear any of Morris' questions, or only very rarely. He's not like a Michael Moore, for example, who needs to get plenty of footage of himself. Morris prefers a careful intervention, leading and guiding the interview, but always wants the "money shot" (so to speak) to be his subject stepping into a rhetorical trap of their own making. Let them indict themselves. Morris has never felt the need to exclaim his personal judgment.

So I watched The Fog of War and The Unknown Known (both great - the former is probably a shrewder piece of filmmaking but the latter is more maddening) and my frustration with American Dharma still holds, but I think I can pinpoint that movie's weakness a bit better now. I think in dealing with such figures, Morris' primary weapon is evidence (I suspect his private detective background plays into this). McNamara's and Rumsfeld's statements, because they deal with concrete actions, can be met with facts, and in both those cases Morris has a substantial historical record to pull from. Bannon's words in the movie deal more with attitude than policy (he never nails down concrete positions regarding the latter and Morris doesn't push him enough to do so). Morris handles that material more easily, but when it gets down to what Bannon's views mean for the world, because they are posed as hypotheticals, Morris doesn't find a suitable replacement for his usual tools and seems uncomfortable pushing the necessary lines of questioning to nail Bannon (or have Bannon nail himself - there's a joke there). It makes sense the most effective passages of the movie are when Bannon talks about the campaign (when Morris has facts and events to work with) and the film discussion (when Morris can use the films cited as totems around which to shape his argument).

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Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:12 pm
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yeah I know….. it probably won’t surprise you to hear that this is not the first time someone has said that someone is trying to gaslight me (us). one thing that always sticks in my head is that at least in the movie Gaslight, Charles Boyer knew that he was lying; I can’t assume to know the intentions of the various Trump critic critics. or what they believe, deep down, about Trump himself. I’m sure they think the Dems and the liberal media and such are gaslighting us. why else would we dislike Trump?

sometimes I’ll read various Trump critic critics’ criticism just so I can keep comporting myself in ways that won’t fall into their worldview. it might be all naught, there will always be enough wingnuts that those people will make visible. I know I’m not going to be able to stop myself from watching Last Man Standing when it returns in October, “one of the only shows right now that reflects real families right now”. (you hear that, lib shows and your un-real families?) but it is exhausting and not fun. I know I have yet to break my patterns of self-abuse.


Sun Sep 16, 2018 4:02 pm
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btw speaking of Errol Morris and movies, did you guys see this anecdote about talking to Trump about Citizen Kane?

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So he’s talking about Citizen Kane, and it’s kind of amazing. I’m not even sure I know what to make of it, and I have to be perfectly honest that my feelings about Donald Trump are clouded by what you might call his current role as president of the United States. So he starts to tell me about Charles Foster Kane, who he identifies with. And what was Charles Foster Kane’s real problem? Was his problem that he was a megalomaniac? Not so much. Was his problem that he treated people around him miserably? Nah! What was his problem? According to Donald Trump, his problem was the woman he married. So at the very end of this clip, I asked Donald Trump, “Would you have any advice for Charles Foster Kane?” And he says, “Yeah! Get yourself a different woman.”


Sun Sep 16, 2018 4:09 pm
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I'm now picturing an Errol Morris Trump documentary.

*cue impressionistic images of pee streams and KFC*

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Sun Sep 16, 2018 4:17 pm
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