Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 66-86

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crumbsroom
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by crumbsroom » Mon Jan 14, 2019 9:00 pm

Shieldmaiden wrote:Look what I got for Christmas:

Image

Now I won't have trouble with subtitles anymore!

Wig, if I watch this, will you come back to talk about it?
Jealous. I asked for this for Christmas, but it wasn't to be. I think my father got sick of buying me Fassbinder's every year, even though I'm sure he has no idea who he is other than some artsy fartsy creep that his artsy fartsy creep of a son likes.
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Tue Jan 15, 2019 2:32 am

crumbsroom wrote:Jealous. I asked for this for Christmas, but it wasn't to be. I think my father got sick of buying me Fassbinder's every year, even though I'm sure he has no idea who he is other than some artsy fartsy creep that his artsy fartsy creep of a son likes.
Aw. :(

I actually got money and turned it into Fassbinder. :P
Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

Voyage | Female Gaze | MACBETH | Sokurov | Fassbinder | Greenaway | Denis | Sono | my bookshelf
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by wigwam » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:00 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:Wig, if I watch this, will you come back to talk about it?
merry christmas! yes I will!! I love this one so much!!!
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Sat Feb 23, 2019 1:44 am

Image Image
Image Image

Circle of Deceit is the best I've seen by Volker Schlöndorff. It's gorgeous and horrific, sometimes at the same time! I hope it counts as NGC. I watched the extra features on the disc (well worth it, by the way) and it seems they carved out a peaceful section of Beirut where they could recreate battles that had actually taken place there five years earlier. There were places where their territory abutted actual war zones, though. So, while it feels like they're really dodging bullets, they're (mostly) not. Schlöndorff said Ganz was especially sensitive to the fact that they were adding chaos to already traumatized lives. But then he (Ganz) got to roll around on the floor with Hanna Schygulla, so that may have helped.
Back to my list, if that's where you want to go.
Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

Voyage | Female Gaze | MACBETH | Sokurov | Fassbinder | Greenaway | Denis | Sono | my bookshelf
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by wigwam » Sat Feb 23, 2019 1:46 am

def counts!! looks great too, howd you watch it? are those extras digitized online at all? I want!!!
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Sat Feb 23, 2019 2:03 am

wigwam wrote:def counts!! looks great too, howd you watch it? are those extras digitized online at all? I want!!!
Sent you a pm. It is pretty, isn't it?

I loved the way it captured the journalist's outsider frustration. They're helpless to do anything real; they don't even hope their reporting can change anything. And there's always the insidious adrenaline high from the danger.
Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

Voyage | Female Gaze | MACBETH | Sokurov | Fassbinder | Greenaway | Denis | Sono | my bookshelf
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by wigwam » Sun Mar 31, 2019 4:29 am

Image

Die Fälschung | Volker Schlöndorff | 1981
108 min | Argos | War | Hanna Schygulla/Jean-Claude Carrière/Margarethe von Trotta
2019-03-30 | MKV | Home, UES
LIKED

This was good but I probably liked the Making Of even more. I've spent a lot of time since Trump got elected imagining civil war in American and at the end of last year before I realized rehab is what I needed I researched going to Syria to fight with the communists (in hopes of either dying for a good reason or learning something to bring back home, Spook Who Sat By the Door-style) (what can i say, I was/am a delusional addict)

I liked what he said in the Making Of abt how civil war becomes even more crassly a method for war lords to profit from fractured society, but kinda wish the movie itself said this instead (it opens itself to specific political readings but he states there was an intentional avoidance of choosing sides). Much of this is what I was expecting Antonioni's The Passenger to be like, and while this is never as effortlessly great as that film, it's admirably frank and unblinking in lots of layers, my favorite is Hanna Schygulla's character showing her life and desires continuing on beside the violence, and in very contradictory and/or versatile ways: her cynical check-cutting at the orphanage and then emotional reaction at the hospital. I feel like here and in that Marco Ferreri movie she gets to a sad vulnerability RWF never wrote for her?

Bruno Ganz wasnt ever a favorite of mine but he's great here and it's not surprising he was having difficulty making this, it shows in the performance in his tiredness and (maybe I'm projecting?) irritability with the constant chaos and misery around him. I'd like to revisit at least American Friend and look for him attaining similar energies I maybe missed the first time. The climax here doesnt even feel cathartic for him (compare with his brutalizing his wife at the beginning) but just like an exasperated fit of frustration.

I laughed (out loud) when the credit for Maurice Jarre rolled by but that and Volker talking abt making this after winning an Oscar for Tin Drum made me think about this as a Blank Check type of movie (if you're not listening to that podcast you absolutely should be!). The score is fine but the idea of seizing the highpoint of your career to go into a warzone and make an ambiguous tone-poem abt futility and misplaced rage is cool.
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Apr 01, 2019 3:55 am

Yay, you watched it!
wigwam wrote:an ambiguous tone-poem abt futility and misplaced rage
This is good, right? I think it's good. :P
my favorite is Hanna Schygulla's character showing her life and desires continuing on beside the violence, and in very contradictory and/or versatile ways: her cynical check-cutting at the orphanage and then emotional reaction at the hospital. I feel like here and in that Marco Ferreri movie she gets to a sad vulnerability RWF never wrote for her?
I didn't think she seemed very sad in this one. Kind of smug, even, but still beautiful. Is that a recommendation of that Ferreri? (I've never seen anything by him.)

And you should definitely take another look at The American Friend. I really love that one.
Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

Voyage | Female Gaze | MACBETH | Sokurov | Fassbinder | Greenaway | Denis | Sono | my bookshelf
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by crumbsroom » Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:01 am

Hanna Schygulla is everything.

Image

Rainer agrees.
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:11 am

crumbsroom wrote:Rainer agrees.
Eh, he couldn't even put his cigarette down. He doesn't appreciate her like she deserves!
Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

Voyage | Female Gaze | MACBETH | Sokurov | Fassbinder | Greenaway | Denis | Sono | my bookshelf
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by crumbsroom » Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:23 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:Eh, he couldn't even put his cigarette down. He doesn't appreciate her like she deserves!
Hanna Schygulla > Fassinbder

As much as I love RW, I think this is an acceptable opinion.
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by crumbsroom » Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:31 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:Eh, he couldn't even put his cigarette down. He doesn't appreciate her like she deserves!
I never noticed him holding the cigarette before. It's amazing how much being aware of that changes the picture.
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:23 pm

crumbsroom wrote:I never noticed him holding the cigarette before. It's amazing how much being aware of that changes the picture.
Haha. I know, right?

Still, Fassbinder > Schygulla, because Fassbinder > everybody.
Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

Voyage | Female Gaze | MACBETH | Sokurov | Fassbinder | Greenaway | Denis | Sono | my bookshelf
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by crumbsroom » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:56 pm

Shieldmaiden wrote:Haha. I know, right?

Still, Fassbinder > Schygulla, because Fassbinder > everybody.
I can't really mount an argument against that beyond 'but did you look at Hanna in that picture'?

But I can never overstate my love of RWF. Fassbinder, Kubrick and Cassavetes are my holy trinity of everything I love about cinema.
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Apr 01, 2019 9:41 pm

She's perfect. But he's so brilliant he burns my retinas!


I'm going to watch this thread's eponymous film next, in case anyone wants to join me.

Wig, you still here? Crumbsroom?

Image
Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

Voyage | Female Gaze | MACBETH | Sokurov | Fassbinder | Greenaway | Denis | Sono | my bookshelf
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by crumbsroom » Mon Apr 01, 2019 10:36 pm

I don't have any access to that, or nearly any of the movies you watch in this thread :(
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by wigwam » Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:02 am

crumbsroom make a dropbox and give SMaiden and I the pword and we can hook you
up maybe

I am HERE! thread title movie is soooo good, Im gonna watch more by her

yes def watch that Ferreri! watch all Ferreri his movies are so ALIVE
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by crumbsroom » Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:26 am

wigwam wrote:crumbsroom make a dropbox and give SMaiden and I the pword and we can hook you
up maybe

I am HERE! thread title movie is soooo good, Im gonna watch more by her

yes def watch that Ferreri! watch all Ferreri his movies are so ALIVE
I don't have a dropbox account. Don't you need to pay for that?
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by wigwam » Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:12 pm

I think it's free you just can't store more than 2 gigs at a time which is usually enough
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Wed Apr 03, 2019 5:22 pm

Love is the Beginning of All Terror – Ah, that German sense of humor, so odd, even alien! Still, compared to the Berlin School films I've seen, this is screwball comedy. The framing is absurdist, the narration drips with irony. Freya talks to her son while blocking the road for a dozen honking cars. She asks Irmtraud (whose head is completely wrapped in a scarf), "Did you cut your hair?" But the moment I really caught on was during the "gang" meeting, when I realized they were all women who had slept with Traugott. Then we find out he's still sleeping with some (all?) of them, and that all their children are his. Ha. It's ridiculous, but Freya remains serious; she's one of a harem, but somehow she thinks it's her story alone. Sander exaggerates that universal tendency only a little bit, skews it just enough to make Freya a clown, but a clown we find very familiar.

Oh, yeah, and what was with the knitting women? I expected that to go somewhere... Madame Defarge-ish.

Image Image
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Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Rock » Tue Apr 09, 2019 2:51 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:
Image Image
Image Image

Circle of Deceit is the best I've seen by Volker Schlöndorff. It's gorgeous and horrific, sometimes at the same time! I hope it counts as NGC. I watched the extra features on the disc (well worth it, by the way) and it seems they carved out a peaceful section of Beirut where they could recreate battles that had actually taken place there five years earlier. There were places where their territory abutted actual war zones, though. So, while it feels like they're really dodging bullets, they're (mostly) not. Schlöndorff said Ganz was especially sensitive to the fact that they were adding chaos to already traumatized lives. But then he (Ganz) got to roll around on the floor with Hanna Schygulla, so that may have helped.
Back to my list, if that's where you want to go.
Kind of loved this. I'm not sure I love the framing device (his crumbling marriage) and I guess I can take issue with the production circumstances but I think the movie is smart enough to channel that queasiness into something that helps the end product.
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Re: Love is the Beginning of All Terror: New German Cinema 6

Post by Shieldmaiden » Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:13 pm

Rock wrote:I think the movie is smart enough to channel that queasiness into something that helps the end product.
Oh, definitely. Well said. And, though I kind of agree about the framing device, I'll defend it as part of this same thing, a necessary look at the toll it takes on those involved.
Ant-Man and the Wasp ▪ Night Must Fall ▪ Colo ▪ Help Me, Eros ▪ Le bonheur ▪ Time Bandits ▪ All About Nina ▪ Love Is the Beginning of All Terror ▪ Capernaum ▪ Mary Queen of Scots ▪ Lazzaro felice

Voyage | Female Gaze | MACBETH | Sokurov | Fassbinder | Greenaway | Denis | Sono | my bookshelf
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