Maiden's Voyage

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Shieldmaiden
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Wed Jun 05, 2013 4:55 pm

B-Side wrote:I'm just teasing you since you seem to have given up on the forum since LEAVES came back and lamented the loss of "poetic" posts. I'm sorry if my questioning the value of Filmwise's series of numbers and letters has led you to believe I'm a narrow-minded fool who can't appreciate a unique voice. Why you think the forum is losing its way is a mystery, and frankly, a bit offensive to those of us who work pretty hard to contribute to it.
I don't think you read my posts. :-/
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Trip » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:01 pm

Shieldmaiden wrote:Thought it was pretty clear I did appreciate it? I'm sure there are plenty of other things you can excoriate me for. :P
Oh, that was ambiguous. I meant us not appreciating the poetry, thus killing you off slowly as with filmwise. Amazing joke.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Stu » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:24 pm

B-Side wrote:I may be reading too much into it, which is normal for me, but this on the heels of two arguments with LEAVES that I was personally involved in in which you naturally took his side which tends to make me feel like I might be the target of some surreptitious rhetoric.
I read her posts agreeing with LEAVES the same as you, and I don't recall her even coming close to attacking you personally. If she wrote something offensive at the time, I'd be happy to read it again if you provided the linkage, but currently, you're beginning to come as off as really unnecessarily petty, and grudge-y. So what if she happened to agree with LEAVES a few times? And so what if she's not fully happy with the forum as is? She should have the right to express those thoughts/feelings, without getting randomly needled about it in a thread that doesn't even have anything to do with any of that.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Stu » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:50 pm

B-Side wrote:I didn't say she attacked me personally, and I didn't say she didn't have the right to express dissatisfaction. Your white-knighting attempt is proving fruitless, so please stop.
No, you didn't quite say that, but you did do everything but:
B-Side wrote:I might be the target of some surreptitious rhetoric.
You implied that she criticizes you in secret (as if random speculation about what someone COULD be saying about you justifies bugging them like this), based on her agreeing with another poster a couple of times, plus her generalized complaint about the forum, a complaint where she didn't even single anyone else out personally, much less you specifically. So again, if any of this resulted from her, at some point in the past, actually posting something offensive to/about you personally, rather than just an insecurity about people not agreeing with you occasionally, provide the linkage and I'll re-consider your points. Otherwise, leave maiden alone.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Trip » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:51 pm

OK, whose journal thread to derail next...
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:11 pm

B-Side wrote:Does that not imply a level of dissatisfaction? I may be reading too much into it, which is normal for me, but this on the heels of two arguments with LEAVES that I was personally involved in in which you naturally took his side which tends to make me feel like I might be the target of some surreptitious rhetoric.
The fact that I have impossibly high standards for discussion and often happen to agree with LEAVES should surprise no one who has known me for the last three years. But the idea that we're colluding somehow is hilarious, considering he won't even answer my pms. And, by the way, I've written (bad) poetry in this thread before. See, no one reads my posts. :P

Can we move on now, please? Go watch some movies!
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by traz » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:14 pm

lol i didn't know derailing journal threads was a trend now

off with their heads!
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Bandy Greensacks » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:15 pm

I wrote a haiku once

Also, nice caps
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by traz » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:22 pm

since maiden likes Fassbinder so much I no longer care if she agrees with LEAVES
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:23 pm

Bandy :heart:

I know some people don't like the way it looks, and I can see what they're saying, but I did like it. The sound was better, though.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Derninan » Thu Jun 06, 2013 7:57 am

Fascinating, perplexing film. I'll never truly know what I really think (or, more importantly, feel) about it until I see it again. All I know for sure is that I appreciated watching.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:22 am

Derninan wrote:Fascinating, perplexing film. I'll never truly know what I really think (or, more importantly, feel) about it until I see it again. All I know for sure is that I appreciated watching.
Yeah, it's disconcerting, for sure. I was put off at first by what felt like choppy TV-commercial shorthand, but the effect slowly grew on me. I loved the way the sounds tied all the disparate threads together.
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Maiden's Voyage: Nobuhiro Suwa

Post by Shieldmaiden » Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:23 am

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  • While nearly every film I write about in this thread can be traced back to various posters here, I intend to set aside more time to watch things specifically recommended for me by you. (Please, recommend away!) Thanks to some dogged prompting by charu, I'll start with a post dedicated to two films by a director she loves, Nobuhiro Suwa. M/Other is a languorous look at the changes in a couple's relationship when they're forced to take in the man's young son from a previous marriage. I liked the expressionistic way Suwa shows the emotional cracks forming, but the best part is his deft touch with the growing friendship between the woman and the boy, including an unusually perfect child performance, something I especially love to find in film. So, it's no surprise that I liked Yuki & Nina even more, as it takes this aspect a step further, the whole film being from the child's point of view. Beautiful Noë Sampy is asked to carry the film, as a sensitive nine-year-old girl struggling with her parents' divorce, and does it with simple aplomb. Co-directed by Hippolyte Girardot (because of its French setting, I suppose), this is a lovely film, with just enough levity and mystery to turn a sad story into one of resilience and hope.
[/list]
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Bandy Greensacks » Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:37 am

Still need to watch those, actually. Yuki & Nina, in particular, sounds great, if a lot like Sômai's Ohikkoshi (which would hardly be a bad thing).

If you want recs... you should try Femina, since I know you downloaded it a while back. I think you'd take as much out of it as I did.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Derninan » Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:41 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:Yeah, it's disconcerting, for sure. I was put off at first by what felt like choppy TV-commercial shorthand, but the effect slowly grew on me. I loved the way the sounds tied all the disparate parts together.
The sound design elevated the film for me. I sometimes felt I could just close my eyes and bathe in it, and I'd be no more the fool than I already was. :P
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by charulata » Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:40 am

awwww, you ended up watching both :heart: :heart:

Re: M/Other
I love how he frequently shoots the actors framed within doorways and windows or in reflection .. that stuff adds so much to the feeling that we are peeking into something terribly intimate and private. And yeah the friendship between the boy and the woman feels so organic and is my favorite part of the film as well. It reminded me a tiny bit of Cassavetes not just because of the subject matter (cracks in relationships etc) but also because of the realism in the dialogues. I read an interview with him long ago and it sounded to me like he works a bit like Mike Leigh in that he workshops the film but allows for a lot of improvisation from the actors. In this one, the two actors even have co-screenwriting credits.

And I love how he goes from the formally rigorous and rather realistic M/Other to something looser with Yuki & Nina (that's how I remember it anyway). That ending in particular is just so wonderful.

He hasn't made anything since then unfortunately and imdb doesn't list any work-in-progress either :(
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:59 pm

charulata wrote:I read an interview with him long ago and it sounded to me like he works a bit like Mike Leigh in that he workshops the film but allows for a lot of improvisation from the actors. In this one, the two actors even have co-screenwriting credits.
This makes a lot of sense, although I didn't notice/guess it at the time. But the dialogue and timing are just perfect. Also, that's really the only way to work with these child actors, right? They're so lovely and natural in both films.
Bandy Greensacks wrote:If you want recs... you should try Femina, since I know you downloaded it a while back. I think you'd take as much out of it as I did.
Watching next. :)
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Bandy Greensacks » Sun Jun 09, 2013 6:46 pm

Shieldmaiden wrote:Watching next. :)
:up: :up:
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by B-Side » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:09 am

BTW, I tried asking Jedi to delete our little argument in here but he doesn't seem to want to. It's basically a stain on my blemish-free reputation, and I'd like it Windex'd away.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Stu » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:12 am

B-Side wrote:BTW, I tried asking Jedi to delete our little argument in here but he doesn't seem to want to. It's basically a stain on my blemish-free reputation, and I'd like it Windex'd away.
I get why you want that gone, but if it stays, I wouldn't worry too much about; there isn't a poster here who doesn't have an undesirable post or two lurking somewhere in their history :)
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by B-Side » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:13 am

It's not just for me. I'm sure Maiden sees it as an annoying distraction, too.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Stu » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:15 am

B-Side wrote:It's not just for me. I'm sure Maiden sees it as an annoying distraction, too.
Maybe, but meh, tomorrow's still a new page anyway, or something... eh, you know what I mean.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:18 am

I'd love to know which of my posts Smalley considers undesirable. :P

And, don't be silly B, it's fine. But let's talk about movies from now on. :heart:
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Stu » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:19 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:I'd love to know which of my posts Smalley considers undesirable. :P
Okay, you might be an exception :D Most of us do though, but that ain't a biggie.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by B-Side » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:26 am

What if I wanna talk about love or sex or the AIDS epidemic in Chad?
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Re: Maiden's Voyage: Nobuhiro Suwa

Post by JediMoonShyne » Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:46 am

Shieldmaiden wrote: So, it's no surprise that I liked Yuki & Nina even more, as it takes this aspect a step further, the whole film being from the child's point of view.
Yeah, so this might be my kind of thing.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by roujin » Mon Jun 10, 2013 1:07 pm

It's really good. Thanks to Char for introducing me to that one.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage: Nobuhiro Suwa

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Jun 10, 2013 1:46 pm

JediMoonShyne wrote:Yeah, so this might be my kind of thing.
It might be! I almost called it a "Jedi movie," but I wasn't sure how much peril needed to be involved. :D
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Beau » Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:35 pm

Delete this undesirable post.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:45 pm

No Beau post is undesirable. :heart:

But, someday, maybe you'll write some poetry in my thread. Speaking of which, have you seen the new and improved Whispering Pages yet?
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Beau » Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:59 pm

Shieldmaiden wrote:No Beau post is undesirable. :heart:

But, someday, maybe you'll write some poetry in my thread. Speaking of which, have you seen the new and improved Whispering Pages yet?
No. :(

Not watching many films lately. Since my days are so unpredictable, I tend to read more, since a book doesn't require me to find a 2-hour gap in my schedule. Which doesn't excuse me from not watching Whispering Pages, I know, because that movie's like ten minutes long. But anyways... Last movie I saw was Now You See Me. God, that sucked.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Jun 10, 2013 3:34 pm

I'm the last person who can criticize anyone for not seeing many movies. Just don't forget about me, please?
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Bandy Greensacks » Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:10 pm

Beau wrote:Not watching many films lately. Since my days are so unpredictable, I tend to read more, since a book doesn't require me to find a 2-hour gap in my schedule.
Fewer Beau reviews is always a bad thing. I may not have said it before (I'm sure others have), but your writing is more than good enough for you to be working for a much bigger site or newspaper.

And I just said this in Maiden's film log, so maybe I should say that I like Maiden's writing, too... but it's worse than Ebola
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:23 pm

Bandy Greensacks wrote:Fewer Beau reviews is always a bad thing. I may not have said it before (I'm sure others have), but your writing is more than good enough for you to be working for a much bigger site or newspaper.
We're all selfishly trying to get more Beau-words here for our own enjoyment, when we should just let him write for the world.
And I just said this in Maiden's film log, so maybe I should say that I like Maiden's writing, too... but it's worse than Ebola
Ahaha! Thanks for nothing.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Beau » Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:17 pm

:oops:

Thanks for the kind words. Since I am now working full time from my laptop, I'll be annoying you guys more than usual. There's also a good number of worthwhile threads running at the moment, all of which discuss spectacular sounding films I've never even heard of. Which is always good. I don't mean this thread, though. This thread is terrible.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by charulata » Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:33 pm

Beau wrote: Thanks for the kind words. Since I am now working full time from my laptop, I'll be annoying you guys more than usual. There's also a good number of worthwhile threads running at the moment, all of which discuss spectacular sounding films I've never even heard of. Which is always good. I don't mean this thread, though. This thread is terrible.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:39 pm

Good news, Beau, even if you hate my thread. :P
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by B-Side » Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:06 am

I'm glad we're all in agreement that Maiden's thread is worse than the holocaust.
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Trip » Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:22 am

the back and forward arrows are like the nazis instructing us to herd to the gas chambers that are really just nice communal showers but then we get gassed later anyway
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by B-Side » Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:37 am

Trip wrote:the back and forward arrows are like the nazis instructing us to herd to the gas chambers that are really just nice communal showers but then we get gassed later anyway
and her "voyage" is really just a voyage toward a unified aryan race
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Trip » Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:44 am

haha
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by rad » Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:53 am

B-Side wrote:
and her "voyage" is really just a voyage toward a unified aryan race
:fresh:
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Trip » Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:55 am

watch out elixir
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Tue Jun 11, 2013 4:28 pm

I... don't know what to say. You guys are crazy. But I always enjoy a good Schindler's List joke. :fresh:
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Maiden's Voyage: Femina

Post by Shieldmaiden » Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:01 am

I've been wanting to see Femina ever since Bandy posted those amazing clips in the 88 Takes thread here, but, for many reasons, I haven't till now. It was definitely worth the wait! With its surreal imagery, boisterous music, and a protagonist struggling to come to terms with her past, it reminded me of Pastoral: To Die in the Country. Though more schematic than that film, it's still a colorful, often disturbing, romp through her psychological influences and obsessions. The childhood segments are the best, an eerie mosaic of suspect memories, vivid imaginings, and nightmare. The camera movement during those scenes is so exhilarating (and the present so staid by comparison) it takes the edge off even the most traumatic moments. But, the present isn't merely more static, it's also more improbable than her memories. "More improbable than Joseph Stalin as her father?" you ask. Yes! Her awkward search for love, her foray into prostitution, and her final cleansing affair are weirdly unconvincing, entangled with puppets, dancing policemen, and faces from her past. In the end, her adult adventures feel just as suspect as those of her childhood, and the progress made (though real) is all in her head.

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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Bandy Greensacks » Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:30 am

Hurray!

Would you call it a feminist film? My perspective is a bit skewed, being a male, and I think I mainly love it for its form and treatment of memory, but I wonder if I missed a larger theme that might increase my appreciation for it even more
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:57 am

Bandy Greensacks wrote:Would you call it a feminist film? My perspective is a bit skewed, being a male, and I think I mainly love it for its form and treatment of memory, but I wonder if I missed a larger theme that might increase my appreciation for it even more
I'll think about it some more and see if I change my mind, but my first impression is, not particularly, no. Her history and psychology are interesting, but, as a woman, I found her actions implausible. (I'm not saying they should be plausible, just that she didn't seem much like me, or other women I know.) The prostitution episode, especially, seemed kind of prurient. And, as I said above, I'm not sure how much of it really happened, so I don't know what to make of her temporary escape from her marriage. But, then, I'm not even sure what sexual issues she's working through. Just Catholic guilt from her mother? Or did someone actually molest her and she turned him into Stalin in her mind?
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Bandy Greensacks » Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:09 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:But, then, I'm not even sure what sexual issues she's working through. Just Catholic guilt from her mother? Or did someone actually molest her and she turned him into Stalin in her mind?
I'm not entirely sure, but this scene always struck me as sexual (rape) rather than informed by religious guilt:

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Her mother and others watch on and even laugh as this man (presumably an exorcist or some other religious figure) straddles her in bed and makes faces that suggest sadistic pleasure
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Shieldmaiden » Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:14 am

If there's supposed to be molestation, it's more likely to be in the Stalin scene (when no one's around), surely? That scene in your pictures is so weird, though! It's the same actor as the gravestone "artist" she has sex with, right? He's also, the "cannibal missionary" in the picture the priest gives her, and the man making out with the woman on the train.
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Bandy Greensacks
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Re: Maiden's Voyage

Post by Bandy Greensacks » Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:23 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:It's the same actor as the gravestone "artist" she has sex with, right? He's also, the "cannibal missionary" in the picture the priest gives her, and the man making out with the woman on the train.
That's true. It's certainly intentional, and I'm assuming that's Szulkin's impression of the unreliable nature of memory.

I don't know... the film is rather impenetrable overall, which is probably a large part of why I like it so much. It becomes almost entirely about technique and repetition, with only small, possibly insignificant details revealed in each scene.

I'd be interested in hearing other people's thoughts, too, if anyone else gets around to seeing it.
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