Scott Derrickson Hooplah

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Hipster Thor
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Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Hipster Thor » Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:04 am

I am a tad bit annoyed corrierino. It seems like for some reason Marvel is the most important thing in culture right now. Any kind of news about what is going on with these movies no matter how insignificant has seem to become it's own industry in and of itself. There are people on youtube who made their careers on being mysogonostic about Captain Marvel. Now granted, Scott Derrickson leaving Doctor Strange 2 isnt insignificant news if you are fan of these movies, but I dont remember a time when behind the scenes news was so, well, not behind the scenes, let alone blown up to such dramatic proportions. And social media isn't helping, with Phil Lord inundating him into the cool kids club for having his ideas rejected by Disney? I guess? Everyone online has some hot take about this and they are often contradictory and I just need to vent.

The first notion I see is that Mr. Derrickson wanted to go in a direction with Doctor Strange 2 that Disney was not happy with and that's why he left the project. Derrickson does cite creative differences for his departure but that could be a huge range of things, from subtle things in the script, to a run time requirement, or he is not happy with the script he currently has but Disney doesn't want to delay production. Derrickson vented about deadlines on twitter just recently.

This leads into the idea that Mr. Derrickson was too bold for Marvel and that leads to Forums and Discords propping up that all Marvel movies are the same and that they aren't cinema and that Disney doesn't like risky things. I mean, maybe I'm wrong but Disney seems to take bigger risks with movies than other studios. Idk who over there green lights films like Nutcracker in the Four Realms. It seems like in a post Endgame world everyone almost seems bitter that the movie succeeded financially and artistically and are desperate to discredit the movies somehow or frantically search for validation of their artistic inferiority and I dont understand it.

The next problem I have is a more personal observation, but I am not sure what great artistic, creative vision Scott Derrickson has to begin with. That sounds mean, but the bulk of his work is pretty mediocre in my personal opinion. I loved Docror Strange, but alot of that is the charisma of the performers and the artistry of the visual effects and I dont know how much of that came from Derrickson's head vs. came with the property from Jack Kirby's art or the artists at ILM. Derrickson always struck me as a working man's director. The bones of the Doctor Strange film are pretty boiler plate. There is nothing in the franchise that screams to me that we need *this* man behind the camera as opposed to say, James Gunn with GOTG. I dont think thr franchise will be worse off as Doctor Strange was serviced fine in Infinity War.

This last bit may seem like I'm backpedaling but the people who think similarly to the last paragraph I just wrote also disrespect Mr. Derrickson to hyperbolic degrees. They say it's not comparable to Marvel losing Edgar Wright because he isnt as talented and that nothing of value was lost. Scott Derrickson has value. Anyone who has directed seven feature films in Hollywood is a talented director. And while the franchise may do fine without Scott Derrickson, it would also be fine with him at the helm. The best action scene in the first movie is the astral projection fight in the hospital room, and that scene was the pitch Mr. Derrickson made that got him the job.

In conclusion, film discourse has devolved into awful hot take analysis with a bunch of armchair journalists just guessing what's going on behind the scenes with delusions of it being some grand drama and its ruining movies for me.
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Wooley
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Wooley » Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:44 am

I am a big Marvel fan, maybe the biggest one here, and I agree with absolutely every word of your post.
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Slentert
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Slentert » Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:14 pm

I would agree that the hot take discourse is aggravating and exhausting.

I would strongly disagree on Marvel or Disney being "risky". I think they're good in giving the impression that they're making bold choices, while still always eventually trying to uphold the status quo.
I'm not saying that other big studios are taking any real chances either, to the contrary. I don't even need my popcorn cinema to be "risky" if I'm being honest, I just need it to be entertaining, nothing more.

I haven't seen Nutcracker, so I'm curious what about that movie makes it such a risk?
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Thief
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Thief » Fri Jan 10, 2020 2:02 pm

The main speculations about his departure are that he wanted to go a bit more "horror" than Disney might've wanted, and that the Doctor Strange film might be more integral to the overall Phase IV arc, which might demand more control from Disney than what Derrickson might be willing to give.

Anyway, I generally agree with your premise about Derrickson's work and overall notability. What else has he directed that was notable? Sinister? The Exorcism of Emily Rose? None of those were particularly groundbreaking or even very good. I liked Doctor Strange well enough, but it's nowhere near my MCU Top 5 or maybe even 10.
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topherH
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by topherH » Fri Jan 10, 2020 2:10 pm

Guy gets angry. Yells at Internet news.
State of Siege |Gavras, 1972| +
Deadpool |Miller, 2016| +
Z |Gavras, 1969| -
The Confession |Gavras, 1970| +
Missing |Gavras, 1982| +
The Revenant |Inarritu, 2015| +
The Hateful Eight |Tarantino, 2015| +

+ Recommended
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Oxnard Montalvo » Fri Jan 10, 2020 3:15 pm

I didn't think Doctor Strange was a great movie but I remember it somewhat fondly 'cause I saw it the weekend after the 2016 election and watching an asshole find his conscience was a little soothing. just a smidge. plus the climatic showdown wasn't one guy violence-ing another guy to death. it was not an unpleasant two hours. I wondered if Tilda Swinton's participation might mean that some MCU fan will end up checking out Derek Jarman's work just as Alec Guinness's appearance in Star Wars would one day lead me to David Lean, Robert Hamer, Alexander Mackendrick

also, I've gotten used to the idea that MCU just does not produce director-driven movies, not unlike so many old-school Hollywood movies. e.g. imdb Wizard of Oz lists six directors, Gone with the Wind three directors. Victor Fleming is the credited director on both but his filmography is hardly that of an auteur like Ford or Hitchcock or Hawks.
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The Nameless One
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by The Nameless One » Fri Jan 10, 2020 4:37 pm

How does Disney manage to switch up directors this far down the line when the release date is May 7, 2021? Despite the more rose scented flavor to this departure compared to, say, Solo, this reminds me entirely of Solo. I'm not at all interested in Disney doing a slap dash job on Dr. Strange. This was the only MCU movie I was excited for aside from Thor, and now I won't see it in theaters out of principal. Say what you will about Derrickson, his flavor relative to the rest of the MCU was unique, for example, if I'm not mistaken Strange is the only MCU movie filmed on film! Personally, Dr. Strange is top 10 MCU, and I find it genuinely confusing that people don't mirror this opinion. Just another notch on the belt of boy do I hate Disney, frankly this is more upsetting than Ant-Man losing Edgar Wright because I'm way more invested in this character
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DaMU
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by DaMU » Fri Jan 10, 2020 5:26 pm

Completely agreed on the toxic modern clickie discourse and how it's become a crazy sort of internet sub-economy that really needs to stop-- and one that basically has to generate "scoops" that are anything but simply to keep the train chugging along. (Drew McWeeny did a manifesto on this recently, and when Drew McWeeny's upset about the state of the discourse, um, we have problems.)

That said, I think I hold Derrickson in a little higher regard than some of you. I'm a big fan of Emily Rose and Sinister (wouldn't call them great, but they worked really well for me) and was curious to see him apply a bit of that sensibility to what he'd already stated would be a more horror-tinged film. It was really the only superhero flick I was looking toward with something resembling enthusiasm. I thought his contemporary David Sandberg did a good job working some of his experience on Lights Out and Annabelle: Creation into Shazam! (and Wan's dips into the Trench in Aquaman), so something similar could've been fun.
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The above-written is wholly and solely the perspective of DaMU and should not be taken as an effort to rile, malign, or diminish you, dummo.
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Popcorn Reviews
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Popcorn Reviews » Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:12 pm

I don't know if I'd call Marvel too risky, but I do agree that the argument that their films are the exact same is wrong (and this is coming from someone who thinks that one viewing of their films is enough). I mean, yeah. Most of them are about superheroes fighting against super villains where the superheroes usually win in the end. However, this doesn't mean that the characterizations, motivations, themes, and the way they go about the story structure are all the same. I think they've changed the format of their films up quite a bit concerning these details. I also felt like Infinity War and Endgame were really unique compared to the rest of the franchise. Anyways, not as down on Marvel as some people here are, but I mostly agree with you.
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Wooley » Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:17 pm

Thief wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 2:02 pm
Anyway, I generally agree with your premise about Derrickson's work and overall notability. What else has he directed that was notable? Sinister? The Exorcism of Emily Rose? None of those were particularly groundbreaking or even very good. I liked Doctor Strange well enough, but it's nowhere near my MCU Top 5 or maybe even 10.
Agreed.
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Hipster Thor » Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:52 pm

Slentert wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:14 pm
I would agree that the hot take discourse is aggravating and exhausting.

I would strongly disagree on Marvel or Disney being "risky". I think they're good in giving the impression that they're making bold choices, while still always eventually trying to uphold the status quo.
I'm not saying that other big studios are taking any real chances either, to the contrary. I don't even need my popcorn cinema to be "risky" if I'm being honest, I just need it to be entertaining, nothing more.

I haven't seen Nutcracker, so I'm curious what about that movie makes it such a risk?
Well the amount of budget they put into a property that isnt relevant with their main demographic would have been my answer. Whenever Disney makes a movie they never seem to go the cheap route, but I suppose that isn't creatively risky. However films like Curse of the Black Pearl, John Carter, and Lone Ranger were kind if big risks and two of those films were financial disasters.

Instead of saying Disney takes more risks than other studios perhaps I should have said they don't take any less/more risks than the other studios and when they do risk something they make the stakes higher with inflated budgets.
Hipster Thor
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Hipster Thor » Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:24 pm

Another side note, but people on the internet seem to approach directors like it's some kind of Dragonball Z thing with Directors having like, power levels. I kind of feel like that is dehumanizing to people like Scott Derrickson. I admit I called his body of work at large mediocre, but that shouldn't nullify the last paragraph I wrote. Artistic talent isnt a constant. Like I said, being a career director requires some level of talent, and just because he hasn't made as "artful" a film as an Edgar Wright doesn't mean he never will and we should encourage him to improve rather than hand waving it completely as "no big loss". Its not a simple black and white situation just like how people aren't black and white
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Evil » Thu Jan 16, 2020 11:48 pm

That last shot or stinger or whatever you want to call it in Sinister really is a fucking war crime though. Just the worst.
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Hipster Thor » Thu Feb 06, 2020 1:12 am

Sam Raimi is now in talks to direct Doctor Strange 2. What a pick.
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DaMU
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by DaMU » Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:02 am

But will they let him go "the full Raimi"?
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Hipster Thor
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Hipster Thor » Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:08 am

Wasn't he able to put Army of Darkness hags into Oz the Great and Powerful? Idk, Sam Raimi not only is one of the most recognizable directors in terms of style, but has a reputation for getting shit done when it needs to get done. You dont push the Raimi button lightly. It's like a doomsday machine. You have the Raimi on call in the hope that you dont have to use him.
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Наравне играть в казино

Post by Davidhiple » Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:01 am

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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Thief » Mon Feb 10, 2020 1:42 pm

Hipster Thor wrote:
Thu Feb 06, 2020 1:12 am
Sam Raimi is now in talks to direct Doctor Strange 2. What a pick.
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Captain Terror » Mon Feb 10, 2020 1:44 pm

Hipster Thor wrote:
Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:08 am
You dont push the Raimi button lightly. It's like a doomsday machine. You have the Raimi on call in the hope that you dont have to use him.
This made me LOL. :) :up:
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Re: Scott Derrickson Hooplah

Post by Wooley » Mon Feb 10, 2020 2:53 pm

I worry that he's going to give us something as atrocious as that Oz movie he did. Dial it back, Sam.
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