YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Mar 05, 2012 5:48 pm

A Comparison of The Picture of Dorian Gray (1945) & Dorian Gray (2009)

Image The Directors of Photography

Image

The Director of Photography for Albert Lewin's 1945 film of the Dorian Gray story is Harry Stradling Sr., who was the lighting cinematographer for 139 titles in a career that spanned a half century, from 1920 to 1970. His first film credit as DP was on The Devil's Garden, and his final job behind the Hollywood camera was for The Owl and the Pussycat, but there are many films you've heard of and read about in his Filmography. He worked with Alfred Hitchcock on Jamaica Inn (1939); he was the DP for In the Good Old Summertime (1949), A Streetcar Named Desire (1951), Gypsy (1962), My Fair Lady (1964), How to Murder Your Wife (1965), Funny Girl (1968), and Hello, Dolly! (1969). Stradling was nominated for 14 Academy Awards, and won two of them: for My Fair Lady, and for The Picture of Dorian Gray. Uhm, not in that order!

Image

The Director of Photography for the 2009 remake of Dorian Gray is Roger Pratt an Oscar nominee for The End of the Affair (1999). Pratt has photographed 41 titles in his career. Among his better-known achievements: a segment of The Meaning of Life (1983), Brazil (1985), Batman (1989), The Fisher King (1991), Twelve Monkeys (1995), Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002), and Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire (2005). Pratt's career continues. As of this posting he is attached to a project called Jadoo scheduled for release in 2013.

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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
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And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Gort » Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:06 pm

Oh, look! It's finally a new page! :up:

Page 13 took from 28 Jan 2012 to 5 Mar 2012 to complete. :shifty:
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:47 pm

A Comparison of The Picture of Dorian Gray (1945) & Dorian Gray (2009)

This has nothing to do with the movies, but I thought it was potentially of interest to someone. Making links is easiness itself. There is a nice conceptual photograph and an excerpt from the Preface to the novel, that includes these words:"The artist is the creator of beautiful things. To reveal art and conceal the artist is art’s aim." I selected the last line as the title to an upcoming essay about the book and how it interfaces with the films.

Image Weblinks for the 1945 Film and other things

Free-of-charge Project Gutenberg e-Book of Oscar Wilde’s The Picture of DorianGray. And another online one from upword.com.

Wikipedia entry about the author of the novel, Oscar Wilde.

Wikipedia article about the novel The Picture of Dorian Gray.

A study guide for the novel from sparknotes.com.

Would you like to buy a copy of the book from Amazon?

Maybe you'd like a free download for your ebook reader from Kobobooks.com?

The Wikipedia article for the 1945 film.

Netflix has the 1945 film on DVD only. If you follow this link while logged into your account, you will go directly to the page for the movie. Otherwise click the "Member Sign-in" button.

Booksie.com has an essay on The role of Aestheticism in Oscar Wilde's "The Picture of Dorian Gray" that looks interesting at a glance.

Did you like that one? Here's another essay about the story, The Conflict Between Aestheticism and Morality in Oscar Wilde’s The Picture of Dorian Gray in case you hunger for knowledge of the literary historical context of the novel and films.

Turner Classic Movies has an essay about the film on its pages.

A Slantmagazine.com review of the 1945 film.

And a review appears on monsterminions at wordpress, because people can't decide what kind of movie this is. Which is cool.


Image Weblinks for the 2009 Film and other things

Naturally, Wikipedia has an entry for the 2009 film.

A blog review by someone who wasn't really thrilled by the 2009 film.

Writing, "The most disturbing aspect about Oscar Wilde’s singular work of 19th century horror literature, The Picture of Dorian Gray, is that its best rendition into cinema is, by default, Oliver Parker’s 2009 adaptation," Brian Eggert begins a review by someone who liked the 2009 film a bit more than the guy in the link above this. Although the closing line, "This might be one of the rare occasions where moviegoers have to break down and—gulp—read the book," suggests that Eggert still finds it a bit lacking.

So we can turn to James Berardinelli, who writes in his review a bit more glowingly about the film. I don't know who the writer is; he's just some guy on the Internet, like YTMN is.

Would you like to see a bunch of screencaps from this film? If you click on one, you see a larger version of it. (Why couldn't I have discovered this before I pulled all my screencaps?)

Wouldn't you know that this story would lead to naming a type of mental illness?

Did you know (I didn't) that there is a band called Dorian Gray? Here's their history.

Dorian Gray was, of course, a member of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. Here is another page about him (I like "Occupation: Dilettante")

A review of a restored version of the text of the novel. (I wonder if this has the same effect as restoring a copy of an old film.)

Netflix has the 2009 movie on DVD and Blu-ray. If you are logged into your Netflix account, you'll go directly to the page for the movie. If not, click "Member Sign-in". In the past the film has streamed, and it may again, someday.

I wonder how many school kids have tried turning in this essay on characters in the story.

Image More and More links to various things Dorian Gray

Pretty as a Picture: the Faces of Dorian Gray, from Monsterland

fanpop.com images from the 2009 film

More DG images, art this time, from fanpop.com

A 2009 DVD rip. Download at your own peril. I didn't try it. I don't even know what the language in the film is. I just found this when searching for images.

There is a Dorian Gray action figure? Yep. Scroll down this page.

Links at filmreference.com



Forbidden Planet International has a page about a graphic novel treatment of the Wilde story.

Hmmm. 2009 was a big year for ol' Dorian. There was a ballet version on Broadway.

More about the 2009 modern ballet version of Dorian Gray.

The promo montage video from the 2009 ballet version of Dorian Gray. For the terminally curious. Excerpts make the ballet seem rather more like Dorian Gay, but that's not a surprise. Dorian's unusual bisexuality was one of the themes of the original novel, apparently. Toned down in the 1891 re-release of the novel. Not even really visible in the 1945 film. Hinted at in the 2009 film. But easy to imagine from the novel. The book was used as evidence in Wilde's sodomy trial, for which he was convicted and served two years in prison.

A fan has made a page of questions. An ESL fan!

Image Trivia Links for Both Films

“In Oscar Wilde's original novel Sybil was a sophisticated Shakespearean actress, not a vaudeville waif. It is her willingness to give up her career, not her spending the night with Dorian, that causes him to break off with her.”

“Already established as a cabaret singer, Angela Lansbury plaintively intoned "Good-bye, Little Yellow Bird" (music and lyrics by C.W. Murphy and William Hargreaves) in this movie. Yet strangely, in her two subsequent MGM films, her singing would be dubbed by two phantom voices: 'Virginia Reese' in The Harvey Girls, a full-throttle Technicolor musical; and Doreen Tryden in The Hoodlum Saint, a moody drama containing a couple of standards. In this film, Doreen Tryden, ironically, supplied the off-screen voice for Donna Reed's reprise of "Good-bye, Little Yellow Bird.”

For more trivia about the 1945 version of The Picture of Dorian Gray.


“This is the second film starring Rachel Hurd-Wood (Sybil Vane) that involves an eternally youthful male lead. The first was Peter Pan.”

For more trivia about the 2009 version of Dorian Gray. But there's not much there. Yet.

Image And Still More links to various things Dorian Gray

Other versions are available on YouTube. Link to part 1 of 10: the 1976 BBC version.

Same thing, embedded. part 1 of 10:



Are you into not-so-good adaptations of novels? This one is less-than-perfect, but I watched it and lived. It streams on Netflix. Called Pact with the Devil, it is also sometimes entitled simply Dorian. A male fashion model is the Dorian in this version.


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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:55 pm

The Dorian Gray Rematch is complete except for essays, now. But I have a dozen more of those planned.




(I must be crazy.) :D
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:30 am

A Comparison of The Picture of Dorian Gray (1945) and Dorian Gray (2009)
The Essence of Horror in Dorian Gray

Image

In a thread at Rottentomatoes forums there was a discussion that I vaguely recall, about what horror is, and how it applies to films. I've thought about that question every once in a while, since the day those posts appeared, and it seems to be a fleeting thing that changes from viewer to viewer. I more or less equate horror with dread; if you anticipate something icky or evil, then it makes dread rise within you, and that, to me, is the essence of horror. The measure of horror is whether a film makes my skin crawl or not. That means it becomes very difficult to assess the degree of dread that a movie pumps up in you if you already know the ending.

To some viewers, physical ugliness induces horror.

Some people equate horror to having sound or images cause them to jump. To me, that is nothing but reflex. It is the same as tapping a person's patellar ligament with a physician's rubber mallet. But some might disagree with my definition of dread-induction as horror, just as I don't see the jump thing as truly scary.

But, I think there is another kind of horror, and it has a different essence: that of not knowing what is going on. And perhaps, the imagination of something that might be going on.

The Dread of Not Knowing
For a number of years that we cannot determine, Dorian Gray has something happening to him that he doesn't understand. At the same time, those around him see him never aging, a thing that they don't understand. In the 1945 film, the Eqyptian cat sculpture becomes the embodiment of this essence. After all, it is the proximity of the cat to Gray when he offers his soul for the ability to never age, that swaps his soul into the picture, and the sculpted cat serves as a visual motif during the rest of the film to signal that all is not right. Apparently, neither Dorian nor his companions ever solve this puzzle, but Dorian finally realizes that his soul is in the painting, while his living body is soulless, ageless, and without morals. How it came to pass is not what he wants to understand.

The 2009 Dorian merely expresses a wish while standing next to his portrait, and the transfer of his soul takes place. It's all story hocus-pocus, but apparently in the mid-1940s it seemed necessary to have a conduit for the supernatural (the cat figurine) whereas by 2009 audiences could buy that a man's ultimately harmful wish might simply come true.

Image

The Horror of Watching Someone Go Astray
There is also a kind of horror that arises as we watch this youthful boy debauch himself in many ways. Oh, it's fun enough to fantasize that we could live a life filled with whatever hell we desired to raise, or whatever heaven we desired to shower upon our friends...but in reality there is often a feeling of guilt after we do the hell things, that is difficult to shake. The intensity and exact triggers of guilt vary from individual to individual, but most of us experience guilt because most of us step beyond the edges of our personal comfort zones at least once. We don't have to go so far as to murder another in order to feel that we've done something bad. So, watching Dorian do the things that he does causes us to feel uncomfortable.

I think that this discomfort is the essence of horror in Dorian Gray. I think it's largely absent in the 1945 film The Picture of Dorian Gray. There is a jump scene with the painting, but that's about it. The film holds itself too distant, and makes itself too much of an intellectual exercise to have any such effect. Hurd Hatfield overdoes the expressionlessness of a young man whose soul has been transported into a painting (the DVD commentary by Angela Lansbury explains that it was Albert Lewin's insistence that he do that, as if all his life had fled into the painting, leaving him empty and emotionless). But in the 2009 film we actually see a bit more than we might want to of Dorian's depraved behavior. It helps us to imagine the discomfort with himself that drives Dorian to try to change, and that attempt is his undoing. There is a little sense of that part in the 1945 film, but it's something that you don't feel...you have to intellectually analyze Dorian Gray's actions and realize what he must have been experiencing. If you don't bother, or simply can't do it, the '45 movie is liable to leave you feeling empty for a different reason than the 2009 version might leave you feeling empty.

Image

But, to Me, Dread is the Essence of Terror
Here is my benchmark for terror. When I was 19 years old (in 1971) my mother asked me to carry out the trash. It was at night. There was a weak incandescent bulb on the back porch. It was only 15 meters from the back door to the place where we kept our trash cans. They sat next to a large fir tree in the corner of the property. But there would have been room for a Grizzly bear to secret itself behind that fir tree. For no particular reason, as I approached the trash cans, and lifted the lid of the one I expected to have room for the sacks I was carrying, the idea came to mind that any kind of monster could be hiding in the corner of the fences behind that fir tree. Instantly, I imagined some hideous thing with claws, fangs, bad breath and deadly intentions swirling around the cusp of the tree to grab and kill me.

I knew it was only my imagination, but I suddenly had a surge of adrenaline jolt my body. I dropped the two sacks of trash into the can, slammed the lid down, turned as if to run, and then got hold of myself (sort of). I can still recall the struggle I had to not run to the back door. I was trembling, partly from the adrenaline and partly from sheer terror. I was aware that I was afraid of nothing but the dark, and that as a 19-year old man I shouldn't be. But my visceral self was terrified in a way that I had experienced only once before in my life. I managed to comport myself well, I guess. I didn't run, but with every step I took I could feel the effort I was having to exert to keep myself from tearing across the lawn, up the steps to the back porch, and through the doorway into the safety of our den! Once inside I walked back to my bedroom, closed the door, sat on my bed and laughed at myself.

But if a film can induce just a small percentage of that feeling in me (remember, it was nothing but my imagination that scared me that night) then I consider it a success as a horror film. The 2009 Dorian Gray does that, so I say that it has the essence of horror; whereas the 1945 version was totally castrated by the Hayes Code, and has nothing to it in that vein. As a horror film, and I'm not sure the earlier movie was intended to be a horror film, the 2009 version is a good head taller than its predecessor.


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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Thu Mar 08, 2012 9:41 pm

Gee, now that I look at it, that middle picture in the post above is really weird. What was I thinking?

It's on to present more tech posts, beginning with a couple from Nosferatu. :D
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Thu Mar 08, 2012 9:42 pm

A Comparison of Nosferatu (1922) & Nosferatu (1979)

Image The Writers

The 1922 version was based on Bram Stoker's novel Dracula which was quite famous by that time. This story was adapted by Henrik Galeen, who had adapted The Golem in 1915 and 1920.

Here is a dialogue transcription made from the completed 1922 film. Obviously, this is not the original screenplay from which Murnau worked.

The 1979 versions were written by Werner Herzog. Freed of the copyright restrictions faced by Murnau, he changed the names of the characters back to those in the Stoker novel. Herzog based his screenplay on Galeen's script, along with Stoker's novel, and added his own touches, which is the right of a screenwriter. Herzog has written 52 titles in his career, producing 24 of them for the screen, and directing most of them. At 70 years old he continues to perform all three tasks. His most recent film was the documentary Into the Abyss released in 2011. Of course the writer's job on a documentary is much different from that of creating a fictional screenplay, but Herzog has shown that he is capable of doing both. In the case of Nosferatu the Vampyr and its German language counterpart, Herzog was working on a labor of sheer love, and must have felt a tremendous amount of pressure to get it right. On the DVD commentary the director/writer admits that he believes Murnau's Nosferatu eine Symphonie des Grauens to be the most important German film ever made.

For a free ebook download of the original novel Dracula by Bram Stoker, go to this website.

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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Thu Mar 08, 2012 9:45 pm

A Comparison of Nosferatu (1922) & Nosferatu (1979)

Image The Directors of Photography

Image

The Director of Photography for Murnau's film of the Dracula story was Fritz Arno Wagner. Wikipedia article. We have seen a bit of his later work in Fritz Lang's films M and The Testament of Dr Mabuse. Wagner worked in the film industry until 1958, so his career lasted from 1919 until the end of his life. Like so many who got involved in the fledgling film industry, he was young, only 25, when he shot his first released commercial picture.

Image

Herzog's films were shot by Jörg Schmidt-Reitwein. Schmidt-Reitwein also worked with Herzog on Heart of Glass, The Enigma of Kaspar Hauser, and Woyzeck. He has worked mostly on feature and documentary films, and some for television. Schmidt-Reitwein's most recent work, Escape From Tibet, was released in 2011. He has won two German Film awards for Outstanding Individual Achievement: Cinematography in his career. One was awarded in 1977, the other in 1984. The earlier award was for his work on Heart of Glass for Herzog.

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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Sat Mar 10, 2012 3:29 am

Jedi, I know you read this thread, but I'm not sure how often. Next time you do, I have a question:

You seem to have an excellent source for scanned film posters. I don't know if you've papered the walls of your Roman apartment with them, or if you find them on the internet already scanned and ready to re-use. I seem to recall that you once told me the URL of a site that has a lot of film posters. I thought it would be nice to find posters for all the films in the Rematches and put up some examples. I got the idea when looking in the posters thread, and remembering that Trip had the excellent suggest for me to use posters rather than DVD box art for the initial posts for these Rematches.

So if you know of one or more, please let me use a few of your favorite poster-site links to go collect some. Looking for larger size ones than I found when doing the thumbnails in the IP blocks.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Sat Mar 10, 2012 4:59 pm

A Comparison of Planet of the Apes (1968) and Planet of the Apes (2001)

Image The Cast of the 1968 Film
The 1968 cast includes people who were behind makeup that hid their faces from the viewing public. This is considered less than optimal acting conditions. Yet, some fairly famous names at the time agreed to wear the foam-rubber appliances that transformed them into semblances of chimpanzees, gorillas and orangutans. The names of the ape characters were chosen from among Roman names (I don't recall all the names from the book, so it might have been the same; I have no copy of the book at hand, only the Wikipedia plot synopsis). Charlton Heston took on the role of George Taylor, commander of the expedition. The other three astronauts with him are bit-players. When he is captured, Taylor meets Zira (a well-concealed Kim Hunter) and Cornelius (Roddy McDowall). For Hunter and McDowall, their roles in this film, and sequels, became what they are best known for, although they escaped typecasting. At the time of release, the actor about whom the greatest deal was made was Maurice Evans, the man inside the Dr. Zaius makeup. Because he had produced a few 1950s vintage Shakespearean film adaptations and had appeared in Shakespearean theater and movies, he was referred to almost without fail as "Shakespearean actor Maurice Evans." But if you look at his prior filmography, it spans a much broader scope than the Bard's works. After the Apes film, Evans was known primarily as the man who played Dr. Zaius.

Image The 2001 players
In Tim Burton's "reimagining" the cast of characters has changed, and broadened. An entire ensemble of humans is added. They can speak from the start. Even more apes have sustained roles. This means that hardly any of the cast members get to shine for longer than a couple minutes. Some credited cast members have hardly any spoken lines. The character names are not Romanesque in the 2001 movie. Charlton Heston plays an uncredited part as Zaius, Thade's father. Mark Wahlberg plays the role that replaced Taylor, which was a role that replaced Ulysse Mérou in the novel. Oh, yeah, I suppose I should point out that the character is named Captain Leo "Marky Mark" Davidson, or something like that. Most of the ape characters in this film have no relationship to any character in the novel or the 1968 film. Thus, only two of the character names from 1968 are used (including the unspoken name of Thade's father). Lisa Marie, who was Vampira in Ed Wood, and the Martian Girl in Mars Attacks, plays the only character in the film whose name comes from the novel: Nova, the feral human girl who becomes the love interest for Ulysse/Taylor, but not for Davidson, who has to have a trendier-named girlfriend called Daena. There is a cast of well-known names behind the ape makeup in this film, just as there was in Schaffner's imagining of the tale. Tim Roth plays the out-of control chimp general Thade; Helena Bonham Carter plays Ari; Michael Clarke Duncan is gorilla solider Attar; Paul Giamatti is slimy orangutan Limbo, trader in human flesh. Estella Warren fills the role of Daena, main squeeze to Leo Davidson, and daughter of Kris Kristofferson's Karubi. Here's a family: Karubi, Birn and Daena. Do those names seem to make sense together? Yeah, not to me, either.


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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Mar 19, 2012 9:43 pm

It's been 9 days since my last post. As penance, I put one together for today.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Mar 19, 2012 9:44 pm

A Comparison of Planet of the Apes (1968) and Planet of the Apes (2001)

This post is not to be confused with the essay about the soundtracks. In that essay I didn't provide any links to the IMDb pages or other sources about the soundtracks or composers. I will remedy that here, but at the top of each section are links to places where you might purchase recordings, if you want 'em.

Image 1968 CD version
The 1968 Planet of the Apes soundtrack CD from Barnes & Noble.
The soundtrack for that and Escape from the Planet of the Apes at Amazon.com, or at Movie Music.com.

Other sources can be found via Google, some of which allow you to steal the music. But you already knew that.

Image
The first of ten soundtrack cuts posted by Bromden75 at YouTube. You'll find links to the other cuts on the YouTube page. Give it a listen and see what you think about it. There is an awful lot of 1960s-TV theme style to the music. I don't dislike it, but I don't love it as much as I did when I was 16. Maybe it will really fill some hole in your musical desires, though.


Here is a remix of themes from the film posted by Lordhelmchen76 at YouTube. The poster's titles say "Composed and Conducted by Jerry Goldsmith. Mixed, Edited & Adapted by Lordhelmchen76."

Jerry Goldsmith had a very long career as a composer of music for television and films. If you scroll down to the bottom of the listing at IMDb, you'll notice that his first credits as composer alternate between film and TV. As time passed, he became known as someone who could get the job done, regardless of filmic genre. For a general idea of his career, watch this clip about his career (from a VHS tape source, unfortunately) at YouTube. On that page you will find links to other interviews with the man.

Goldsmith's musical styles range from jazz to the avante garde atonalities of the Planet of the Apes score. He composed and conducted the film score that I have listened to more times than I have any other: Star Trek the Motion Picture. I listened to a tape recording of the soundtrack 157 times that I counted. Eventually I bought the CD and listened to it an uncounted number of times (I was less obsessive by that point in my life). But Goldsmith didn't write scores for only sci-fi films. The earliest of his scores that I enjoyed in a film is that for The List of Adrian Messenger (1963). He had worked as a film composer for only 6 years when that movie came out. He composed the music for Lilies of the Field and Patton. Incredible range! War films, love stories, science fiction, crime dramas, horror films, animated films, comedies. Apparently he was a fearless composer who was ready to try his hand at creating music for anything. Sort of the musical equivalent of Donald Sutherland. Study the list of titles on his IMDb page, and you might come away from the experience impressed. You will see more than one title that you recognize on the page (probably whoever you are).

Image 2001 CD version
Find the CD at Amazon.com.
Or get it from Movie Music.com.
CD Universe has both CDs and mp3 versions for sale.

Amazon also has mp3 downloads available.

Image
At YouTube someone calling himself scoretracker has posted tracks from the 2001 movie. This one is the main title theme. It should get your blood going, even if you don't like the film!

Danny Elfman started as a pop musician. He and his brother started a successful act called Oingo-Boingo. I became aware of him as the composer and performer of the track "Gratitude" from the cassette album of music from the movie Beverly Hills Cop (1984). I liked the track, and it stood out to me, but I never saw a music video based on it. If you follow the link you can see the music video, but you have to watch an ad first, since it's posted to VEVO. Danny Elfman's name got stuck in my head, as well as his musical style, and I began to notice his name in titles sequences for films I watched on HBO. I noticed that he composed the music for Beetlejuice (1988). Then I saw his name associated with Pee-wee's Big Adventure (1985). After that his credits turned up on Scrooged (1988), Batman (1989), Somersby (1993), and then scores of other projects. Elfman was born in 1953, so he hasn't had as long a career as Jerry Goldsmith did, but he has the same reputation of fearlessness, and an ability to produce a solid score for films. A quote from him that I like is, "I get drawn to things that don't make any sense, and I learned early on not to resist that."

Both composers who were associated with these films were, I think, good choices. Their resultant work undergirds and expands the films. And their careers show them to be capable of not only solid musical composition, but occasional sheer brilliance. Their work is good to listen to.


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:07 am

A Comparison of Nosferatu (1922) & Nosferatu (1979)

Image The Players of 1922
The 1922 cast includes German actors and actresses who were beginning their acting careers at the time, as well as a couple better-knowns. Max Schreck appeared in 43 titles between 1920 and 1936, but the role of Graf Orlok was his first starring role. He had appeared in four films prior to Nosferatu. Gustav von Wangenheim, who plays the role of Hutter, had a long career prior to Nosferatu, but continued acting for only four more years. In 1936 he became a writer-director, and created five films between 1936 and 1956. Apparently he left Germany, because his 1936 film Der Kampf is highly critical of Naziism, and was made in Moscow. Greta Schröder who plays Frau Hutter, had a brief career as a screen writer in 1915 and 1916, but was an actress from 1913 to 1954. Alexander Granach began his film acting career in 1920, and appeared in 54 films by the time he completed his work in films in 1944. He died the following year at age 51.

Image The 1979 Cast
In the 1979 cast we find some well-known names for modern audiences. Klaus Kinski, Count Dracula in this film, is well-known to students of German cinema. Kinski began acting in films in 1948, ultimately appearing in 135 titles (directing the final two). Isabella Adjani, who is Lucy Harker, also played Emily Bronte in the same year as this film. Her 44 appearances include an impressive number of starring roles. She is widely known for playing Camille Claudel in the film named for her character.

The actor who embodies Jonathan Harker in Herzog's Nosferatu, Bruno Ganz, won 14 awards out of 21 nominations for his acting. His career has continued since his first film role in 1960. In 2012 he will appear with Mads Mikkelsen in a film that is still being edited as of this writing. Roland Topor, who plays Renfield in this film, was known for writing as well as for acting. It was Topor who adapted the screenplay, and wrote the dialog for Fantastic Planet. His 1964 novel The Tenant became a 1976 Roman Polanski film. Herzog says in the commentary track for Nosferatu that he hired Topor for his maniac personal style and especially his laugh...which Herzog had another actor dub when (apparently) Topor's French accent turned out to be beyond easy comprehension for viewers.


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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Thu Mar 29, 2012 3:14 am

A Comparison of Nosferatu (1922) & Nosferatu (1979)
The Soundtrack Recordings

Chris Edwards writes about the original score for the 1922 film.

Image 1922 CD & mp3 versions

The score for a silent film as old as Nosferatu, eine Symphonie des Grauens will have either disappeared, or will have been recorded on some interim sound release with the original music in place. Many films of the silent era had scores written, with orchestral, organ, and piano arrangements available for many, all, some? of them. Hans Erdmann wrote a full score for the 1922 film, but if you look on the Full Credits page for the movie, you'll see that at least 10 composers/bands have recorded musical tracks that have been released with the film over its history.

Erdmann has only 4 films in his filmography on IMDb. Two of them are Mabuse outings. The first, of course, is Murnau's vampire movie, and the fourth is called August the Strong, from 1936. Born in 1882, Erdmann died at age 60, loeaving only those four scores behind. On the KINO video release of Murnau's film, Erdmann's score is reconstructed. It sounds good. Some of it, I am led to believe, is taken from other classical music pieces, although much of it is Erdmann's original work. I have heard other scores with the film.

This page has a description of the reconstituted Hans Erdmann score. A story of the reconstruction is written by Gillian B. Anderson, who along with James Kessler, put the score back together.

The original Erdmann score is available on the 2007 KINO DVD as 5.1 or 2.0 stereo. From Amazon. From Silent Era.com, which seems to function as a clearing house for Amazon in the US, Canada and the UK, so you might find what you want on this page. Because this is a silent film you will hear the score without encroaching sound effects even from the DVD.

Image Sample the Erdmann score on YouTube. Embedded below.



MP3s of a modern score for the 1922 film, available from Amazon. Composed and performed by Silent Orchestra.

James Bernard composed original music for a restoration of the 1922 film, and that can be found here. It is a fitting, effective and pleasant piece of music, but I don't know about listening to it without the visuals. I haven't done that.

Image Sample the James Bernard score on YouTube. Embedded below.



Image While hunting for other possible posts on YouTube I ran across this link, which is for the entire film with a live improvisational organ soundtrack played by Mathias Rehfeldt. I thought, "why the hell not?" The opening section sounded okay, so I grabbed the whole thing to listen to later, and embedded it here for you. Clearly, this is not the best print of the film, but from this post you'll be wanting to listen to the soundtrack, right?



If you Google the title and date you can find other sources of other tracks that have been created for the film.

Image 1979 CD version

Herzog says in the commentary track for his 1979 film that he loves the score created by Popol Vuh for the film. Both the German and English versions use the same score, of course. Because Herzog's film is a sound film, the music is accompanied on the soundtrack by sound effects and dialogue. To hear the music by itself requires listening to a soundtrack recording. And, becasue the film was created for release in 1979, there is only one soundtrack score available for it. Popol Vuh also created the score for Herzog's earlier films Aguirre, and Herz aus Glas. Their music fits well with Werner Herzog's films, because their style is experimental and edgy, as are his films.

The soundtrack for Herzog's 1979 film, as MP3 downloads from Amazon. Currently unavailable! Might become available in the future.

Sellers for the Herzog soundtrack on used (and costly) LPs.

A 65-minute digipack from The Laser's Edge. Whoever they are.

CD Universe offers the 1979 soundtrack on a CD release. You may also buy the MP3 album from CD Universe.

AllMusic.com has the 1979 soundtrack available.

Image Sample the Popol Vuh soundtrack at YouTube. Embedded below.




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If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Thu Mar 29, 2012 3:38 am

I'm considering another pair of films for the next potential Remake Rematch whenever I manage to get one of these wrapped up.

Mr Carmady and I had an exchange about 3:10 to Yuma in the upcoming Films thread. That gave me an idea.

MrCarmady wrote:Of course, I support your right to choose :P
3:10 to Yuma was the one that popped into my mind since I saw the original recently...

Gort wrote:Now, that might be an interesting Rematch. Two films that I have no interest in seeing. It would reveal whether I loved either one, first of all, and if I felt indifferent toward both, how would that affect my essays and such? It would require me to analyze two films that are new to me at the same time. I've never done rematches with films that I had not seen before (meaning I had always seen at least one before deciding on that title for the rematch).

Could be a nifty experiment. Also, I might discover a nice film in one or the other. It's worth considering. Thanks.

MrCarmady wrote:You're welcome, and you're wrong for having no previous interest in the original, it's one of the best shot and tensest classic westerns I've seen.

Gort wrote:"Wrong" is a rather strong word, isn't it? :D

EDIT: I requested both DVDs and a book that contains the original short story form* the local library.

MrCarmady wrote:Did its job :P

Gort wrote:Actually, I was already in the process of ordering them when I read your post!


Yep. I was merely waiting to find out if I could actually request all the materials from the local library system when I read Mr C's opinion of my lack of desire to watch these movies. But, the requests are approved, entered, and will be on their way probably by today.

After I watch the films I'll have to decide whether it's worth all the effort to create Rematch, especially if I don't care for either film. But, I'm basically easy to please. I predict I'll find at least one enjoyable.

*do you understand how difficult it is for me to leave my original typo intact? :D
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:23 am

Whups! There it is.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:24 am

A Comparison of The Maltese Falcon (1931), Satan Met a Lady (1936) & The Maltese Falcon (1941)

The 1931 and 1936 Soundtrack Recordings

Well, this was easy. The 1931 and 1936 versions don't have any commercially available soundtrack recordings that I can locate online. That's not much of a surprise. And I don't have an essay planned about the musical scores for that reason (although I reserve the right to give myself that assignment at a later time). In fact, IMDb doesn't offer much information about the soundtracks for either film: The Maltese Falcon (1931). Satan Met a Lady (1936). At least for the '36 remake they offer the information about two songs that play in the film.

The 1931 credits list only Leo F. Forbstein as conductor: Vitaphone Orchestra. In other words, the soundtrack uses stock music recordings throughout. Between 1929 and 1949, Forbstein has an incredible 601 titles under Music Department. On most he seems to be credited as "Musical Director." He has 5 credits as "Composer." And, he won an Oscar in 1937 for Anthony Adverse. He was nominated for Best Music, Score in 1938 for the movie The Life of Emil Zola. Thus, it isn't clear to me when Forbstein was simply selecting tracks and when he was composing them.

The 1936 credits do not include anyone as composer, though the IMDb Full Credits page lists two names: Bernhard Kaun (uncredited) and Heinz Roemheld (uncredited). The reason for this is likely that they were staff composers for the studio who wrote stock music tracks, that were chosen by the editor for any given film. Thus, they recieved no screen credit, although if you look at the IMDb listings for the inclusion of their compositions, there are hundreds of uncredited insertions between them! I guarantee that you have heard their music, and so have I, aside from these two films.

Image The 1941 Film Soundtrack Recordings

Huston's version is popular enough that the original music has been re-recorded for commercial distribution. Below is a list of the tracks composed by Adolph Deutsch, and recorded in later times by The Moscow Symphony Orchestra. Deutsch composed music for 79 titles between 1928 and 1961 (although it looks like his first two compositions weren't released until 1930). Early titles that I recognize include They Drive by Night (1940), and High Sierra (1941). The rest of his substantial output during the early period was for films I've never heard of. But someone has. After the 1946 Shadow of a Woman I recognize a greater number of his titles, such as Intruder in the Dust (1949), Father of the Bride (1950), Tea and Sympathy (1956), Some Like It Hot (1959), and The Apartment (1960).

Here are a few sources for the re-recordings of Deautsch's score, which seems to be available in only one collection:

The first 8 tracks on "The Maltese Falcon and other film scores by Adolph Deutsch" are from Huston's film. All are recorded by The Moscow Symphony Orchestra. They all bear the note "restored J. Morgan," and are available on the CD, or as mp3 downloads from Amazon.com. The same CD is available from cdUniverse.com, and the mp3 versions are available from ClassicsOnline.com.

Although there is only one "recording" I offer you three sources for getting your hands on it.


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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
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If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:16 pm

Dear Rematch Readers,

Birthday weekend put me way behind on on the regular stuff, but I had two dinners out bought by friends, and a few extra excursions besides. And the rest of my 3:10 to Yuma exploratory package came in at the library. I picked up the book and two DVDs this morning. But before I can get to them I have:
1) Regular work stuff
2) Laundry that didn't get done due to birthday fun
3) The film The Makioka Sisters to watch for The Fortnightly Film Club thread (Oops, I talked about it somewhere else besides The Fortnightly Film Club)
4) More laundry that didn't get done on Saturday

And then I have the on-going films being compared in this thread. Must do some work on all those posts.

Anyway, the experiment to see whether I'd like to make a Rematch between two films that I never had plans to watch is set up and poised to begin. My first step will be to read the short story, which I'll get underway while I eat lunch today.

Regards,
YTMN
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:12 pm

I have now read the Elmore Leonard short story "Three-Ten to Yuma" on which the two films are based.

I can see how there might be a tense film adapted from it. But I wonder what they added to fill out the 90 minutes or so. I assume backstory and stuff.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
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If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Colonel Kurz » Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:36 pm

90 minutes in the first case, 120 in the second.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by MrCarmady » Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:26 pm

Looking forward to it! I am a fan of Leonard but haven't read this particular story, actually. It's probably online somewhere, I'll check it out if you go ahead with the match-up.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:27 pm

I am really looking forward to this new remake rematch, actually.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Apr 02, 2012 10:29 pm

Colonel Kurz wrote:90 minutes in the first case, 120 in the second.

Yeah, then there must be a lot of slooooow motion in the second one. :D
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Apr 02, 2012 10:32 pm

MrCarmady wrote:Looking forward to it! I am a fan of Leonard but haven't read this particular story, actually. It's probably online somewhere, I'll check it out if you go ahead with the match-up.

I found it nowhere on line for free, so I ordered the book through the library.

Apparently, it bears little resemblance to the 2007 film. But it made the writer of this blog entry like that film even more.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Apr 02, 2012 10:33 pm

Hank wrote:I am really looking forward to this new remake rematch, actually.

Oh, God! Now there's pressure on me to actually do it. :shifty:
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Gort » Mon Apr 02, 2012 10:34 pm

Hank wrote:I am really looking forward to this new remake rematch, actually.

Wouldn't it be best if I first finish up at least one or two of the FIVE that are already running!? :D
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:39 pm

Well, it's your hobby... do what you'd like! Do I finish every painting before moving on to the next? Of course not! Right now I have about a dozen and a half in progress.

(One of my hobbies is reading your hobby.)
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:54 pm

Hank wrote:Well, it's your hobby... do what you'd like! Do I finish every painting before moving on to the next? Of course not! Right now I have about a dozen and a half in progress.

(One of my hobbies is reading your hobby.)

That's not nearly as bad as the 147 novel manuscripts I had started at one time. Obviously, most of those are still unfinished. And then there are the novels that remain un-begun!

I am honored that you enjoy my hobby, too. Well, maybe that word 'enjoy' is misplaced, but I'm honored that you read it.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:21 am

A Comparison of The Day the Earth Stood Still (1951) and The Day the Earth Stood Still (2008)

Image 1951 CD & mp3 versions

Bernard Herrmann wrote the theme and incidental tracks for the 1951 film. The main title theme song is cool beyond description, but I don't recall much of anything else, although I've seen the film nearly a dozen times. Herrmann composed the scores for 83 films and TV series in his career.
Amazon, CD or mp3 Soundtrack for the 1951 movie.

Image On YouTube you can hear a sample.

Image Someone else has constructed a suite from the music, and posted it at YouTube.



Image 2008 CD & mp3 versions

Tyler Bates is the man behind the score for the remake. He has credits on 64 titles just since 1993.

2008 soundtrack from Amazon.com. Apparently not available as mp3 files. Oh, well, rip your own after you get the CD.

CD Universe has a link, but their source is Amazon Marketplace.

Image As for samples on YouTube, sure you can find some. Here's one to start with.



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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:01 pm

I have now seen the 1957 original film of 3:10 to Yuma, with Glenn Ford and Van Heflin and a slew of famous faces whose names don't come readily to mind.

That's two steps down, and one to go. I've read the short story, and viewed the first film. I took notes, too. ;)

Chances seem 50/50 at this point that I will decide to at least do a Remake Weematch, much reduced in scope, with reviews, a couple of essays and a few tech posts. Doing even a Weematch would require watching each film at least 2 more times. So I can decide this only after I see the remake.
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If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Gort » Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:12 pm

YouTookMyName wrote:Chances seem 50/50 at this point that I will decide to at least do a Remake Weematch,

Oh, I know how this goes. Gort does all the research and writing; YTMN takes all the credit. :roll:
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:25 pm

WeeMatch!
:D
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:33 pm

Hank wrote:WeeMatch!
:D

If a director remade a feature film as a short, it might be called a weemake. :)
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What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
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If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 10, 2012 1:42 pm

Dear MrCarmady,

Upon due reflection and consideration I have decided to proceed with the Remake Weematch comparing the two 3:10 to Yuma films from 1957 and 2007.

Regards,
YouTookMyName
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 10, 2012 1:43 pm

ImageImageImage


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 10, 2012 1:43 pm

3:10 to Yuma ESSAY BROKER
Image

These essays comparing the films are available. Click on a thumbnail image to go to the essay post.

ImageImageImage
ImageImageImage

ImageImageImage
ImageImageImage

ImageImage
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by MrCarmady » Tue Apr 10, 2012 1:49 pm

YouTookMyName wrote:Dear MrCarmady,

Upon due reflection and consideration I have decided to proceed with the Remake Weematch comparing the two 3:10 to Yuma films from 1957 and 2007.

Regards,
YouTookMyName

:)
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:46 pm

MrCarmady wrote: :)

What is posted so far sure doesn't look like 12 hours' work does it!? :D
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Colonel Kurz » Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:49 pm

I wonder how you feel about the different endings.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:57 pm

Colonel Kurz wrote:I wonder how you feel about the different endings.

It is certainly true that there are three different endings. But are they so different?

Have you ever read the short story?

As for how I feel...time and typing will tell.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:13 am

A Comparison of 3:10 to Yuma (1957) and 3:10 to Yuma (2007)

Image Image Image Image Image
Recordings & Ways to See Without Buying

Perhaps I should offer up choices for people to watch these films right off the bat, instead of when I feel like getting around to hunting up the links. Here are links I've found for the various discs (and mp3s) plus some links to Netflix discs and YouTube videos about these two films. Enjoy. And report back as the other posts go up!

ImageImage Soundtrack CDs

Generally, you might consider both of these unavailable through regular channels. Unless you have a spot of money burning a hole in your poskets.
Sources for the 1957 Film Soundtrack: Amazon yields an mp3 of Frankie Laine singing one of the worst songs I've ever heard. You might love it, though. Kurz says he's heard worse. Amazon has a vinyl LP if you have megabux. And an audio CD is available from Amazon if you have even more bux.

Sources for the 2007 Film Soundtrack: Amazon has some from 3rd parties at a premium price.

ImageImage DVDs

You can find both films on DVDs. The 2007 film even streams from Amazon.
Sources for the 1957 Film on DVD: Amazon & another on Amazon. Here's the same DVD as the first, from Barnes&Noble. And here's the second DVD from TCM's shop. The 1957 version also can be bought from Amazon Instant.

Sources for the 2007 Film on DVD: Amazon Also available to buy or stream on Amazon instant watch. From Oldies.com. From DVD Empire.

ImageImage Blu-ray Discs

Sources for the 1957 Film on Blu-ray Disc: So far, none. The film hasn't been released on Blu-ray as of this posting.

Sources for the 2007 Film on Blu-ray Disc: Amazon or BestBuy, even at Sears online.

ImageImage If you have a Netflix Account

Order the 1957 Film DVD at Netflix.

Order the 2007 Film DVD or Blu-ray at Netflix.

ImageImage Might as Well Check these Out

Sources for the 1957 Film on YouTube: Thanks to lucian33ABC you can hear the Frankie Laine title song from the 1957 film. If you have an account so that you can sign in, the entire 1957 film is available. Signing in to watch YouTube movies is a new thing as I post this! I wonder how it will affect some of my earlier linkses.

Sources for the 2007 Film on YouTube: A post of the entire film. You have to log in, though. Thus, I haven't previewed it. NinjaDoctor9 has posted many audio clips from the 2007 soundtrack. Here is one to get you started. Try listening to this without thinking Morricone, even once.

Obviously, there are bittorrent trackers such as Karagarga.net which apparently shows you nothing unless you enter through some back door! But I don't use them, so I don't have any information about them.

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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by MrCarmady » Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:50 am

it's karagarga, but they don't have the remake anyway
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:35 am

MrCarmady wrote:it's karagarga, but they don't have the remake anyway

Thx. I corrected.

Maybe someone knows where those who download could find it. I mean, besides logging into an account on YouTube and saving it using a downloader.

Try your libraries! That's where I found the copies I watched.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:00 pm

A Comparison of The Picture of Dorian Gray (1945) and Dorian Gray (2009)
A Bit Coy, or In Your Face?

Image

Times change, of course. The movie industry has changed with the times (some would say it has also changed the times). Of the many adaptations of Wilde's story about young Dorian Gray (19 so far, not counting the pornographic versions), most were created for television, or in a time when the explicit nature of Wilde's novel could not be translated to the screen. Even in the most explicit English language version, that created in 2009, the fullness of the debauchery is left to the viewer's imagination. But, this is true to the novel. Wilde merely mentions acts that the beautiful young man does, causing his portrait to take on the scars and ugliness that are within the boy.

But the 2009 film actually shows an actor pretending to be Dorian Gray, who is apparently pretending to do all sorts of scandalous acts. These acts were once unspeakable, unprintable, and when Wilde dared to write about them in a way that is timid by modern standards, he was charged with a crime. In 1945 when Albert Lewin made a screen adaptation of the book, the Hollywood self-censorship put into place in the 1930s (the Hayes Office) prevented him from mentioning most of what Dorian is said to do in the book. But the murder is left intact, of course.

1945 Had More Rules
Dorian's 1945 sins are mostly what a character in Smoke Signals calls "the worst sin," and that is "to break someone's heart." Dorian uses women and men for his own personal pleasure; granted, they derive personal pleasure from their assignations with him, but Dorian is cruel, has no conscience. Apart from his sexual depravity and a murder, the 1945 version of the boy does very little that is out of the ordinary. That is because what he does that is salacious has been kept from the screen. Also, it is impossible to depict the breaking of thousands of hearts over the years (Dorian is about 19 or 20 when his portrait is painted, and is in his 40s when the novel ends). That is a sense you can get only from reading the novel.

Those around him grow old and gray while he retains his youthful looks. They don't know, most of them, what this beautiful young man does when they are not around. But his many victims do. They know. And we know as the viewers, because we can imagine it from the hints.

The 2009 Film may Go Uncomfortably Far
The 2009 adaptation boldy shows both the opposite-sex and the same-sex affairs that Dorian undertakes. It shows that he uses large quantities of alcohol and drugs. He is bound by no one's marriage vows. And, as in the novel and the earlier films, he makes dead people. His wide-ranging depravity was too salacious for 1945, and is perhaps tame by stereotypical rock-star lifestyles in 2009. He is basically a person who, bereft of a soul, does whatever he damn well pleases. He believes himself to be immortal and beyond fatal injury. Indeed, nothing seems to stop him until the final confrontation between Gray and his portrait.

I think the more honest portrayal of how Dorian Gray behaves (or misbehaves) cranks up the creepy factor in the 2009 film. Because his hedonism is more clearly revealed, the actor portraying him can be more emotive than Hurd Hatfield could be in 1945. The only way Hatfield could depict his character as soulless was to play him as an emotionless creature. That reads as "wooden" in 2011. Ben Barnes is able to smile, laugh, and enjoy his vices, which merely shows him to be without a soul. Whereas Hatfield's Dorian appears to be a walking dead man, Barnes's Dorian has crossed the line from feeling personal responsibility to totally dissolute behavior. People do this. They don't often get the chance to keep it going for 25 years, but people do this.

Imagination is Good.
I'm not opposed to things being left up to the imagination, but the extremity to which that is taken in the 1945 film works against the power of the story. Please don't misunderstand me: the 1945 film is a masterpiece. It doesn't make Dorian lovable, merely more enigmatic than the 2009 remake. If you like vague storytelling, then you'll prefer the '45 flick. This is a tale about how easily a person can lose his or her soul, and how difficult it is to recognize when that happens, if you are the affected person. The 1945 film leaves me feeling none of the horror of this, but the 2009 film has created a feeling of emptiness both times I have watched it.

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What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 17, 2012 6:27 pm

The "views" column on the forum page shows me that people have been at least looking in here, maybe reading. Or maybe it's all just bots scanning the forum for new search engine fodder.

I've still not had the hours necessary to grab my still frames from the two films, but I've started some graphics, and decided to post the 3:10 to Yuma essay that I can complete without needing all the frame grabs. That will get me started.

On Saturday my day was plumb ruined by plumbing. An installation of faucet and valves in one of our bathrooms took six-and-a-half hours. But this is my day off from work, and I'm hoping to have the inclination to sit for 4-6 hours later today and pull all the frames I'll need, and lots more. Then I can begin to build graphics for the five essays I've written. Wait, I'll need graphics for only four essays, because the first one is done, and ready to post in this thread.

Soon, I need to put up something new for the poor ol' Apes Rematch. There have been a few tech posts; the latest of those in that Rematch went up 10 March 2012. But the most recent Apes essay was posted in January of this year. I can finish the Apes project almost as swiftly as I can finish the 3:10 Weematch, because I have only one tech post (the one with all them there web links) and five essays remaining in my original plan.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 17, 2012 6:28 pm

A Comparison of 3:10 to Yuma (1957) and 3:10 to Yuma (2007)
A Little Accompaniment
Image

Why'd You Do It, Frankie?
The 1957 film opens with the most hideous Frankie Laine song I have ever heard. There may be worse, but I haven't heard them. It's the words. A phrase such as "the train caaaalled the threeeee-ten to Yumaaa," should not be sung. Period. I think atonal modern operas demonstrate that clearly. But, if not, this song from 1957 will suffice. Also, the vocal arrangement sucks. That's my opinion, of course.

The melody is lovely. When characters sing it off in another room, or whistle it later in the movie it is not at all unpleasant.

Don't just take my word about the Frankie Laine song, though. Who knows, maybe you'll love it?



The composer for the film was George Duning, who earned composer credits for 173 titles in a career that began in 1943 (with his first screen credit appearing for Johnny O'Clock in 1947), and lasted until 1997. Duning died at age 92 in the year 2000. His compositions continued to be used by television producers, and he accumulated his last screen credit (so far) in 2004.

A Varied Kind of Score
The 2007 film has a different musical ambiance. The cuts range from simple plucked guitar, an occasional strum tossed in for good measure, to fully-mounted orchestral swells. The melodies, where they exist, are nice. Atonalities where they are used seem emotionally on the mark.

The fact is that the 1957 score was written at a time when scores were simply supposed to supply emotional cues. I believe the intention was to direct the viewer how he or she should feel in the moment. The music was intended to be an adjunct to, rather than a part of, the story. By 2007 the role of a film score had become vastly different; the modern film score is a part of the story, it does not stand outside the story. Nor does it (usually) direct the viewer's emotions, but it demonstrates the emotions of the composer when viewing the film. Thus, the modern film score becomes just as much a part of storytelling as the production design, the lighting, the camera placement, or the picture editing.

Not a Bad Listen
As the credits roll and roll for the 2007 film, the score plays in isolation. It is not bad music to listen to at all.

During the sequence at the end of the film, as Dan Evans navigates an increasingly malleable Ben Wade toward the prison train to Yuma, the music is so quintessentially Morricone-inspired Spaghetti Western music that I had to grin. And make a note of it so I wouldn't forget to write it in an essay.
Want a sample? NinjaDoctor9 has posted many audio clips from the 2007 soundtrack on YouTube. Here is one to get you started. Try listening to this without thinking Morricone. Embedded below.



Marco Beltrami composed the score for the 2007 film. To date, Beltrami has screen credits for 80 titles.

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What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 17, 2012 6:56 pm

Wow, Martin Teller already wrote a fine review for the 1957 3:10 to Yuma. Should I just skip it!? :D
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by MrCarmady » Tue Apr 17, 2012 6:59 pm

NO (though that is a fine review indeed)
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:01 pm

MrCarmady wrote:NO (though that is a fine review indeed)

K

I like imagining how the 1957 film would seem if the music were replaced with Beltrami's score for 2007. I think it would be...nice.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Colonel Kurz » Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:39 pm

Beltrami also did a good western score for The Three Burials of Melquiades Estrada.
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