YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:34 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:Well, maybe it's not. They're both based on the same book. I thought that counted? How was it, anyway?
Yes, I think for purposes of my thread being based on the same book would make it suitable for a Rematch.

I really don't recall the 1999 movie blowing me away or anything. I wasn't watching films in the same way back then, though. It was more or less to kill time. So, I wasn't disappointed, but I didn't buy a DVD of the thing, either. I bought almost every movie I liked then, thinking that I would watch each one again...but there are always new movies, and old ones to discover, so eventually I came to my senses and stopped buying everything I liked! Becoming poor helped with that goal, of course.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by dreiser » Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:35 am

Le Femme Nikita (Besson, 1990)
Point of No Return (Badham, 1993)

Rollerball
(Jewison, 1975)
(McTiernan, 2002)

Suspicion
(Hitchcock, 1941)
(Grieve, 1987)

Spoorloos (Sluizer, 1988)
The Vanishing (Sluizer, 1993)
"I hate the dark, the sharks liars. And the stems of cherry..."

Like Someone in Love (Kiarostami, 2012) 4/10
Killing Them Softly (Dominik, 2012) 2/10
The Wonderful World of the Brothers Grimm (Pal/Levin, 1962) 6/10
The Dark Past (Mate', 1948) 7/10
New Rose Hotel (Ferrara, 1998) 3/10
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by ribbon » Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:36 am

omg no The Vanishing is sooo bad.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by dreiser » Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:37 am

ribbon wrote:omg no The Vanishing is sooo bad.
I didn't mind it actually.

But, yeah, the second Rollerball was pretty awful.
"I hate the dark, the sharks liars. And the stems of cherry..."

Like Someone in Love (Kiarostami, 2012) 4/10
Killing Them Softly (Dominik, 2012) 2/10
The Wonderful World of the Brothers Grimm (Pal/Levin, 1962) 6/10
The Dark Past (Mate', 1948) 7/10
New Rose Hotel (Ferrara, 1998) 3/10
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Shieldmaiden » Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:42 am

YouTookMyName wrote:Becoming poor helped with that goal, of course.
Haha, yes. Same here.

Thirteenth Floor is on Netflix Instant, so I can satisfy my curiosity, which is really the only reason I suggested it. :P
But, then, just in case you do the match-up, I'll be ready.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:50 am

dreiser wrote:Le Femme Nikita (Besson, 1990)
Point of No Return (Badham, 1993)

Rollerball
(Jewison, 1975)
(McTiernan, 2002)

Suspicion
(Hitchcock, 1941)
(Grieve, 1987)

Spoorloos (Sluizer, 1988)
The Vanishing (Sluizer, 1993)
drei, I think I've inadvertently given you a new hobby. ;)

I've seen both Rollerball movies. And I've seen Hitchcock's Suspicion. I've also seen the Besson, but I recall nothing about it.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:51 am

Shieldmaiden wrote:Haha, yes. Same here.

Thirteenth Floor is on Netflix Instant, so I can satisfy my curiosity, which is really the only reason I suggested it. :P
But, then, just in case you do the match-up, I'll be ready.
Ha ha. It will also be much quicker for you to watch it on Instant. It might be months before I get around to most of the ones I pick.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:14 pm

Some great recommendations. Remakes remade by the original director could make for some interesting essays. I hadn't mentioned Funny Games because I am myself confused as to why it was made... I've seen both versions and I don't really get the purpose. Of course, I didn't go deep into thought about it like YTMN would. Perhaps it would be a good one for that very reason.

I think I'm going to make a serious effort to watch both films for upcoming remakes once you post the chosen few.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by dreiser » Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:48 pm

YouTookMyName wrote:drei, I think I've inadvertently given you a new hobby. ;)
I was kinda bored; killing time.
"I hate the dark, the sharks liars. And the stems of cherry..."

Like Someone in Love (Kiarostami, 2012) 4/10
Killing Them Softly (Dominik, 2012) 2/10
The Wonderful World of the Brothers Grimm (Pal/Levin, 1962) 6/10
The Dark Past (Mate', 1948) 7/10
New Rose Hotel (Ferrara, 1998) 3/10
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Jul 31, 2012 1:10 am

Hank wrote:Some great recommendations. Remakes remade by the original director could make for some interesting essays. I hadn't mentioned Funny Games because I am myself confused as to why it was made... I've seen both versions and I don't really get the purpose. Of course, I didn't go deep into thought about it like YTMN would. Perhaps it would be a good one for that very reason.

I think I'm going to make a serious effort to watch both films for upcoming remakes once you post the chosen few.
Wasn't able to make it through either the German language or English language versions of the film. I made it somewhat farther into the English language version. I have read something about the movies since that leads me to believe that they aren't quite as violent as I feared, but what was getting to me was the humiliation.

The remake was done because US audiences don't like reading subtitles.

I can't stand the series based on Meet the Parents because of the ridiculous amount of humiliation that Gaylord Fokker is subjected to. No idea why. In fact, it gets to me so much that I didn't watch any of the sequels. :shifty:
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Tue Jul 31, 2012 3:36 am

Ugh. Meet the Parents and the rest are all horrible. I didn't want to see any of them... But have seen them all on bus trips!

Interesting comparison, as I wouldn't have referenced them with each other, but I can see your point. Funny Games is a lot of off screen violence... and the ending is certainly something that can stir some discussion. Anyway, looking forward to seeing your picks.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Ace » Tue Jul 31, 2012 3:56 am

Guess Who and Guess Who's Coming to dinner?
Co host of the Film Raiders Podcast.
Were on Spotify, Itunes, SoundCloud, Stitcher, TuneIn, Blubrr,Iheartradio and many more.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Gort » Tue Jul 31, 2012 1:16 pm

While researching and bookmarking this morning I discovered something interesting.
IMDb Connections for Miller's Crossing wrote:Yojimbo (1961)
these are all variations on a mash-up of Dashiell Hammett novels Red Harvest and The Glass Key
A Fistful of Dollars (1964)
these are all variations on a mash-up of Dashiell Hammett novels Red Harvest and The Glass Key
So I could do a Rematch with the two versions of The Glass Key, Yojimbo, A Fistful of Dollars, Last Man Standing, and Miller's Crossing. Six movies, one Rematch!?!???!!!?

Good grief!
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by dreiser » Wed Aug 01, 2012 12:34 am

Gort wrote:While researching and bookmarking this morning I discovered something interesting.


So I could do a Rematch with the two versions of The Glass Key, Yojimbo, A Fistful of Dollars, Last Man Standing, and Miller's Crossing. Six movies, one Rematch!?!???!!!?

Good grief!
Ha, ha.

BTW, I have watched the other two theatrical versions of The Maltese Falcon and survived the experience. Thoughts posted later.
"I hate the dark, the sharks liars. And the stems of cherry..."

Like Someone in Love (Kiarostami, 2012) 4/10
Killing Them Softly (Dominik, 2012) 2/10
The Wonderful World of the Brothers Grimm (Pal/Levin, 1962) 6/10
The Dark Past (Mate', 1948) 7/10
New Rose Hotel (Ferrara, 1998) 3/10
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:31 am

dreiser wrote: BTW, I have watched the other two theatrical versions of The Maltese Falcon and survived the experience. Thoughts posted later.
Gosh, and you were apparently brave enough to watch them fairly close together. Now you need to see the 1941 again if you haven't already, and you'll see how obvious it is that Huston borrowed more than his DP from the earlier versions.

I really look forward to your comments. You can post them at the "appropriate time" vis a vis my posts, or just toss them up on the screen whenever you like. I'm finishing up the novel re-re-re-read. I love Hammett's novel, by the way.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 01, 2012 2:49 pm

A Comparison of The Maltese Falcon (1931), Satan Met a Lady (1936) & The Maltese Falcon (1941)

Image The Directors of Photography

1931 William Rees
Image
The Director of Photography for 1931 was William Rees, and the film was his 16th credit for photography. This puts The Maltese Falcon roughly halfway through his career as a director of photography, numerically speaking. He lived until 1961, but his last DP project was in 1935 on Don't Bet on Blondes. It is of interest to me that he was born in 1906 in Miller County, Arkansas, where my mother would later be born, in 1930, the year before The Maltese Falcon was released. His career lasted from 1923 in the silent era until 1935, but he also has three other credits for Camera and Electrical Department that span from 1923 to 1934. In 1934 Rees was selected to photograph another William Dieterle film (Dieterle directed the middle film in this Rematch) starring Bette Davis. TCM has a write-up about that film, Fashions of 1934.

1936 & 1941 Arthur Edeson
Image
Listing the Director of Photography for 1936 and 1941 will save some space in this post, because Arthur Edeson did the same job on both films. I noticed his name in the opening credits when re-watching the middle film recently, and realized that just as Brown Holmes was involved in the 1931 and 1936 screenplays, Edeson was involved in shooting the second and third films. Remember, if you've read that Rematch, that both Lord of the Flies films were produced by the same man. I'm watching for such interesting cases of double-duty now when I read the credits for remakes!

Edeson's 1941 photography is compared to that of Gregg Toland on Citizen Kane in an essay in this Rematch. His career spanned 36 years, and 135 photography credits. Among these are The Thief of Bagdad (1924), All Quiet on the Western Front (1930), Frankenstein (1931), The Maltese Falcon (1941), and Casablanca (1942). He was nominated for three Oscars in his career.

Image
His camera is fluid and mobile in all the films I've seen from his listing at IMDb. Satan Met a Lady is no exception to this, although the camera work in the 1941 re-remake is superior in its ability to keep our eyes focused on what is happening. The first time I watched the 1941 film I didn't even notice the camera-work, because it is so perfectly attuned to showing us what we need to see and understand in each shot. As I pointed out in the essay comparing Toland's and Edeson's work on two 1941 movies, Edeson's camera can swiftly follow Sam Spade as he walks across the lobby of a train station, and never draw attention to either itself or to the set. We're watching Spade's frantic movements, and Edeson makes sure we can see every one of them. Even when the camera doesn't move, the framing is carefully settled on what is the most salient detail of the scene. And Edeson makes great use of Max Parker's 1936 sets, and Robert Hass's 1941 claustrophobic sets.

The 1936 photography emphasizes the comic aspects of the script, while the 1941 photography brings out the dark nature of the story. Edeson was a genius, at least in terms of his work that I've seen. And he was the kind of genius who recognizes that if you notice his photography instead of the story (at least on the first viewing) he has failed. Subsequent viewings allow you to study exactly how he does this vanishing act for a first-time viewer.


Go back using these buttons.ImageImageImageImageImage
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by charulata » Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:06 am

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Sat Aug 04, 2012 11:50 am

Wow, IMDb says there are actually 6 films from the same source! At least they are all currently available on DVD. I'll be interested to learn if the 1946 film was suggested by the 1943 film (probably was).

Researching these noms is almost as much work as doing a Rematch!

I've always had trouble deciding which films to use for a rematch. Right now I'm using an Excel spreadsheet to keep track of everything about all these suggestions. :D
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by charulata » Sat Aug 04, 2012 11:55 am

[quote="YouTookMyName"][/quote]
I'm not entirely sure. As far as I know Visconti didn't have the rights to the James M Cain novel that the 1946 and 1980 films are based on. So it's a bit of an illegal adaptation :). And it's possible that someone already had the rights to it and that the idea for the Hollywood adaptation was in the works already when the Visconti came out. I am yet to watch that Visconti and am excited to read your thoughts on how the different versions compare.

I've always loved the idea for this thread btw and it's fun seeing a new edition being planned.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Gort » Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:11 pm

I guess it's fair to put my own nominations in here!

King Kong 1933
King Kong 1976
King Kong 2005
I have seen all of these, and own a Blu of 1933, and a DVD of 2005 (the second one sucks so much I haven't bought it; and look, it's the most expensive to acquire! Go figure.)

Peter Pan 1924
Peter Pan 1953
Peter Pan 2003
I own the 2003 DVD, and have had the '24 version bookmarked as one to see for a long time. It would give me a chance to compare silent to animated to live-action. And there are even a couple of TV adaptations that are well-known (or used to be) to throw in the mix if I wanted to.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:14 pm

charulata wrote: I'm not entirely sure. As far as I know Visconti didn't have the rights to the James M Cain novel that the 1946 and 1980 films are based on. So it's a bit of an illegal adaptation :). And it's possible that someone already had the rights to it and that the idea for the Hollywood adaptation was in the works already when the Visconti came out. I am yet to watch that Visconti and am excited to read your thoughts on how the different versions compare.

I've always loved the idea for this thread btw and it's fun seeing a new edition being planned.
We've already had one of those in the thread!

I like the fact that a Postman Rematch would include English, Italian and German language films.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Sat Aug 04, 2012 1:19 pm

Nice nominations, Gort. The possibilities for Peter Pan seem quite interesting.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Gort » Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:46 pm

Hank wrote:Nice nominations, Gort. The possibilities for Peter Pan seem quite interesting.
True. It affords an opportunity for some historical research, as well. To try to glean the background of the tales.

It's probably not totally fair for me to nominate things, though, since I have an inordinate influence on YTMN's choices. :shifty:
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:48 pm

Well, at least you inherently know what he looks for in film.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Gort » Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:52 pm

Hey, I just noticed that my avatar isn't synchronized when it plays back in two different browsers on the same computer!
Image
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

Rematch Resurrection Catalog for Rounds 1-4 New post 180721 -- YTMN's Remake Rematch Thread.
Thread Resurrected 21 Jul 2018. Thread abandoned 1 Aug 2017. Thread COMPLETE 25 May 14 (2d time!)


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Sat Aug 04, 2012 5:30 pm

A Comparison of
The Maltese Falcon (1931), Satan Met a Lady (1936) & The Maltese Falcon (1941)

Hammett's "Brigid O'Shaughnessy"
Image

On the first page of Dashiell Hammett's novel, Ruth Wonderly enters the office of Spade and Archer and sets an entire story in motion--with an elaborate lie. So it takes an actress who can play a liar to pull off this role. For one thing, her name is not Ruth Wonderly. But in 1931, the writers adapted Dashiell Hammett's novel by simplifying the names of the character into a single name. The adaptation in 1936 did the same thing (using a different name). But I remember how awestruck I was when I first heard Mary Astor say that her name was not Wonderly, or Leblanc, but O'Shaunessy when I saw this film in high school or college.

She was tall and pliantly slender, without angularity anywhere. Her body was erect and high-breasted, her legs long, her hands and feet narrow. She wore two shades of blue that had been selected because of her eyes. The hair curling from under her blue hat was darkly red, her full lips were more brightly red. White teeth glistened in the crescent her timid smile made.

What could Hammett have meant by pliantly slender? I've no idea; but it sounds poetic, and more than slightly erotic. As for her age, a few pages later "Wonderly" makes this claim while explaining how her younger sister got mixed up with Floyd Thursby: "I don't know where she met him. I mean I don't know where in New York. She's five years younger than I--only seventeen--and we didn't have the same friends." Is Ruth Wonderly actually 21 years old? Who knows? That becomes one of the delightful things about her character. She is a combination of sleazy and attractive--just the thing for a film noir woman. It's easy to wonder how soon Spade will step off the edge with her. But he is wary. He says of her, "Now you are dangerous."

But in the film, this character is clearly not only 21 years old. Bebe Daniels looks closer to that age than her counterparts, but she was 30 years old when she played Ruth Wonderly in 1931. She is very good at playing a lying character. It's true what Spade claims at the end of the story: that she's never been honest with him for a half hour. And the same claim is made in the novel. In fact, Ruth Wonderly is much like Brigid O'Shaunessey from the novel, except that she never changes her name. Daniels plays her with the same subterfuge, and with the same alternately maniac and quiet threat that Hammett writes in the book. Daniels, in pre-code times, is allowed to show her upper chest and shoulders in a bathtub; and her scenes with Ricardo Cortez get very suggestive. But by modern standards it's all tremendously tame. Still, it was edgy enough for the times for it to be impossible to reissue the film five years later. Thus, Bette Davis as Valerie Purvis in 1936.

I believe I've written elsewhere about the speculation that I read (from some internet writer): that the success of The Thin Man in 1934 may have had some effect on the decision to restructure The Maltese Falcon as a comedy. I've read nothing that suggests why the title was changed to Satan Met a Lady, but clearly the change to the Horn of Roland for the Macguffin is motivated by comedy. A jewel-stuffed horn is goofier (and therefore more comic) than an enameled golden bird. Hey, this is Hollywood we're talking about here.

I also read an opinion somewhere that Bette Davis was merely walking through her part in protest of having been cast in the film. I think the writer mistook Davis's careful portrayal of a woman who is never what she appears to be, for failure to act. In fact, I read in a TCM article about Fashions of 1934 that Davis didn't think of herself as a glamor girl, so she would not likely have rebelled at the notion of playing the kind of character that gets to crow about having out-maneuvered a man, in her last on-screen line! To my eye Davis gives a good performance in her role as Valerie Purvis. And she and Warren William have a humorous chemistry that buoys up the entire film. This has become more obvious to me over several viewings. In fact, as a film I like Satan Met a Lady more than I do the 1931 original adaptation. And I enjoy Bette Davis's turn as Purvis to the same degree that I enjoy Bebe Daniels as Ruth Wonderly, and only slightly less than I do Mary Astor's performance as Brigid O'Shaughnessy in the 1941 masterpiece.

Astor shines, of course, in her performance. For one thing, she is given all of O'Shanghnessy's best lines from the novel. And she does an incredible job at balancing the many sides of Brigid O. You can believe that she is terrifed, but trying to cover, when Spade threatens to leave the whole thing behind early in their working relationship. Yet, he also kisses her. As a manipulator of men, Brigid O'Shaunessy has developed a highly-tuned sense of whether she has hooked a guy or not. She also understands the incredible things men will do out of lust for the object of that lust. And she uses them as her pawns, playing them off one another with finely-honed tactics. Of course, Samuel Spade understands the ways in which women influence him, so he has O'Shaughnessy's number from the start. This is a marvelous case of one character manipulating a character who is in turn manipulating (or at least using) her in order to achieve an end result. The important thing about Astor's performance is this: even if you've never read the novel, you can see all those aspects of Brigid O'Shaughnessy in her characterization of the woman!

Just as Huston's other cast members do, Astor finds the subsurface aspects of Ruth Wonderly/Brigid O'Shaunessy, and lets us know about them, sometimes only as a glimpse. Altogether, her performance is masterful and well-rounded.


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Aug 06, 2012 5:49 pm

Ace wrote: It's a Preboot.
Perhaps this calls for a Pre-make Pre-match?
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What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Mon Aug 06, 2012 6:19 pm

That's one beautiful wall of text! :D
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Aug 06, 2012 6:44 pm

Hank wrote:That's one beautiful wall of text! :D
Thanks. I've got another.

Coming right up. I hope it's also beautiful.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Mon Aug 06, 2012 6:45 pm

A Comparison of
The Maltese Falcon (1931), Satan Met a Lady (1936) & The Maltese Falcon (1941)

Is 1941's The Maltese Falcon Optimistic?
Image

At any given time someone is having a Bad Day, Week, Month, Year, Life--you name it. At the same time, someone is having a great day. Somehow literature for adults is more prone to focus on the vagaries of life than on its blessings. A story almost has to feature something going wrong for the protagonists; the farther and more things go wrong, the better the story. In some of Dashiell Hammett's short stories and novels the protagonist has an incredible cascade of things that go wrong, one after another. Just when you thought he was safe, his best friend turns out to have it in for him!

Film noir is reputedly focused on the darker side of human existence, notably existence in cities, specifically in the bellies of those cities where the stories take place. Almost always set in some large place with a high population, the stories feature characters with vague morality, a low esteem for human life other than their own, and perhaps without a shred of esteem for their own lives.

I have read that Huston's film became the defining example of films noirs to the French cineastes who invented/defined that genre. Yet the John Huston version of the Dashiell Hammett tale that became fodder for three movies seems to end with Justice being served. The novel ends on a slightly lower note. But Huston struggled with the ending. Apparently, he first filmed the ending that finishes off the novel. Then he decided that the story could end with the first of the falcon-chasers being led down to City Hall for interrogation. He reshot, and developed the ending that we see today. I may be stretching a point to call the film "optimistic," but I think in noirish terms the idea fits. Whatever his reasons, Huston doesn't provide a recap with newspaper headlines that explain everything, the way the first Maltese Falcon film does.

But the open-endedness is only a gesture. In fact, we know what will happen to Miss O'Shaughnessy/Gutman/Cook/Cairo after they leave the vicinity of the camera lens. The earlier versions and the novel confirm just how badly things will go, in fact. But Huston left much of that to our imaginations. This works. Even if we've never read the novel we know that things aren't going to work out for those who hope to return to Europe and capture the real, golden bird.

Without us explicitly hearing what happens to Cook, and Cairo, Huston's final shot of Miss O'Shaunessey behind the bars of the elevator gets the idea across very clearly. And it carries the optimistic trope that Justice will be served. As for what happens to certian of the characters, (spoiler-tagged) in case you haven't seen the films:
In the novel and the 1941 film Gutman dies at Wilmer Cook's hand, but Cook and Cairo are arrested by the police. In the 1936 version Madame Barabbas is arrested, but her gunman Kenneth is shot and killed. Later, Valerie Purvis evades capture by Ted Shane but turns herself in, letting a railway employee claim the $10,000 reward that Shane intended to get. Thus, she has victory over a man. Then, Miss Murgatroyd turns up on the train, and she and Shane go off to "Have a lot of fun" exactly in the way that they had planned. The 1931 film ends with the shooting of Cairo and Gutman by Wilmer Cook, who is then gunned down by the police. Miss Wonderly goes off to prison, and Spade is promoted to Chief Inspector of the San Fran DA's Office. But he comes to the women's prison where Wonderly is locked away, and directs that she should have anything she wants. Except her freedom, of course.
Since this is a comparison, I should say that the 1931 version of the film remains the most cynical for the bulk of its running time (for those who didn't read the spoiler block above). Naturally, the 1936 comedic restyling has a happy ending. Perhaps it would be best to characterize John Huston's 1941 ending as somewhere on the continuum between bittersweet cynicism and the giddy pairing that exists at the end of Satan Met a Lady.
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If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Aug 07, 2012 12:43 am

I've looked into the availability of DVDs for the recommended films at Netflix (which took a while) and out of the 99 movies suggested so far, there are 87 DVDs available. Some films are not available on DVD, which means that I can't do a Rematch including that film.

But that's no biggie. If I select 8 more upcoming Rematches, estimating 6 weeks to finish each, and schedule them over the next year, I'll barely scratch the surface of the nominated pairs and trios of films!

Only four of the films involved in Rematches are not available on home video, though. One of those in my list is one I discovered when researching the pair on IMDb. Waterloo Bridge was remade in 1962 as Leaves of Autumn, which is not available. That wouldn't keep me from comparing the 1931 and 1940 films if I wanted to. 1935-The Glass Key is not on video. 1949-The Secret Garden isn't on video, although as I wrote in an earlier post, it is shown from time to time on TCM. Although the 1907 Ben Hur is not available on disc, it is available at archive.org.

I have a couple other films that I've considered for RR's in the past, and one of them might make it into the list. Disney's Pinocchio would make an interesting Rematch with the live action version made in 1996. And I could compare the bizarre 1925 silent version of The Wizard of Oz to the 1939 wonderpiece. Those aren't in my noms post yet.

I'm working on this, and still accepting suggestions in the nominations arena.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Aug 07, 2012 12:35 pm

A Comparison of
The Maltese Falcon (1931), Satan Met a Lady (1936) & The Maltese Falcon (1941)


Image Weblinks of Interest

Almost everything you can find on the internet concerning The Maltese Falcon deals with the novel or the 1941 film. Here are a number of links presented in no particular disorder.

Wikipedia has an article about the 1941 film. Are you surprised?

Wikipedia has an article about the 1931 film. Surely, you didn't expect this.

Wikipedia even sports an article about the 1936 version of the film, Satan Met a Lady.


The 1941 script in pdf format is here. This is the version used by John Huston for his first feature film. 161 pages. The ending conforms to the novel. Huston later re-wrote and re-shot the ending.

Hammett's 'Maltese Falcon,' 75 Years Later from NPR, originally broadcast on 9 February 2005.


The Maltese Falcon study guide by National Endowment for the Arts.

Another study guide about related works, from the NEA.

A list of resources about Dashiell Hammett.


A review of the 1941 film by Tim Dirks, at Filmsite.org.

A brief biography of Hammett on The Dashiell Hammett Website.

Lillian Hellmen writes a memoir about her friend and sometimes lover, Dashiell Hammett.

Something silly in a somewhat interesting way.Adam Savage made a replica of The Maltese Falcon and he tells about it here. From 12 February 2008.


About "Baume's rush," a phrase used by Sam Spade in the novel.

Roscoe's Glossary of Hard-boiled Slang. Same thing in the Free Republic archives (no nice graphic formatting, but no jump to this from the other page this way).


Review at Moviefone of the 1941 film.

Google books preview of a book by William Luhr The Maltese Falcon by John Huston

A blog about the 1931 version.


Listen to Dashiell Hammett's Sam Spade short stories on line Sounds like someone set up a cassette recorder to tape playback from a speaker, so the sound quality isn't excellent...but you can follow the stories, if you're interested.

In case you want to see these pages again: IMDb link and RT-link


Search result from Google for "the maltese falcon dvd"

Google Product search for "the maltese falcon blu-ray"


Amazon search for The maltese Falcon

Bogart's career according to HubPages.com


The Maltese Falcon in The Black Mask magazine

An essay about mystery tropes, that examines "Logical Hiccups: Film Mystery Solutions Meeting the Audience Half-Way", from screened.com. Subtitled, "Mystery solutions that solve themselves on film. Or how The Maltese Falcon is similar to Dude, Where's My Car?" Posted 13 December 2011.

Hammettisms in The Maltese Falcon.

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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Tue Aug 07, 2012 11:27 pm

A Comparison of
The Maltese Falcon (1931), Satan Met a Lady (1936) & The Maltese Falcon (1941)

Hammett's "Effie Perine"
Image

We meet Effie Perine in the novel on the first page of text. Following a description of Samuel Spade, there is this passage:

He said to Effie Perine: "Yes, sweetheart?"
She was a lanky sunburned girl whose tan dress of thin woolen stuff clung to her with an effect of dampness. Her eyes were brown and playful in a shiny boyish face. She finished shutting the door behind her, leaned against it, and said: "There's a girl wants to see you. Her name's Wonderly."
"A customer?"
"I guess so. You'll want to see her anyway: she's a knockout."
"Shoo her in, darling," said Spade. "Shoo her in."


Image
This was dreiser's avatar on a couple of occasions. The first time it appeared I was reading The Maltese Falcon and it clicked in my head as "a boyish face." I saved it for this essay. All three actresses chosen to play Hammett's Effie can also qualify as having "a boyish face." The thing is, even after a Google search, I don't know whether that is supposed to be a negative in Hammett's eyes or in his readers' eyes. Of the three, Una Merkel, Marie Wilson and Lee Patrick, the only one who has playful eyes is Marie Wilson. She was only 20 years old when she played Miss Murgatroyd in Satan Met a Lady.

All three actresses had long careers in film and television. Wilson died the youngest, at 56, but the other two lived past 80 years old. In the 1950s I recall the name Una Merkel appearing on the guest star listings for a lot of television shows we watched, but I had no idea who she was. For that reason, when I saw her name in the cast listing for the 1931 movie, I felt a nostalgic sort of familiarity. Likewise, Lee Patrick turned up in episodes of TV shows from time to time, always playing old ladies. And even Marie Wilson was a guest star on TV during the last 10 years of her life, from 1962 until she died in 1972.

Comparison of their characterizations is complicated by the fact that both Effie's are competent secretarial types, and play the detective aspect of the character well. Remember that Spade compliments Effie Perine on her "detective abilities" the morning after Miles Archer is dispatched. But Miss Murgatroyd is the ditzy, yet foxy-smart kind of secretary character. The only way to approach this is to examine the characterizations in light of the character being demanded by the script.

Merkel's Effie is less demure, and in some ways less assertive than Patrick's. Both play a convincing extrovert, noticing other people and their needs. This is how Effie is written. But she has a very high degree of blindness for Miss O'Shaughnessy's deception, right up until the very end of the novel. As I recall, the 1931 Efie doesn't continue to fall for the deceiver's wiles. But because Huston was playing very close to the source material, the 1941 Effie Perine urges Sam to go on the wild goose chase incited by a phone call that comes while she and he are examining the rara avis that the captain of La Paloma has brought to Spade's office. I have no idea if this is supposed to be suggestive of Perine's sexuality, because there aren't any other clues in the novel.

Murgatroyd is a typical entertainment blonde. She makes cute little sounds in her throat, and is wide-eyed much of the time. Yet, she maintains the overall competence of Effie Perine, and turns out to be at least as shrewd as O'Shaughnessy-counterpart Valerie Purvis, in the end. Of the three Perine-based characters, she's the most fun to watch, as far as I'm concerned.

At the moment I can't remember whether Huston's Spade asks Effie to get in touch with her cousin at UC Berkley in an effort to authenticate the Maltese falcon object. I know that in Satan Met a Lady Ted Shane asks Miss Murgatroyd to contact her relative in order to authenticate the Horn of Roland. The scene is in the novel, between Spade and Perine (who speaks first in this excerpt): "The thing he wants belongs to her?"
"Or to the King of Spain. Sweetheart, you've got an uncle who teaches history or something over at the University?"
"A cousin. Why?"
"If we brightened his life with an alleged historical secret four centuries old could we trust him to keep it dark awhile?"
"Oh, yes, he's good people."
"Fine. Get your pencil and book."


Although she doesn't get as much screen time or page time as some of the other characters, Effie Perine is an absolute necessity to the story of The Maltese Falcon; just as important to how the tale unfolds as Sam Spade or Miss O'Shaughnessy. She has her finger on the pulse of the city so to speak, and takes care of behind-the-scenes errands for Sam Spade. She is trustworthy and discrete, and this comes across clearly in all three performances in this trio of movies.
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If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Tue Aug 07, 2012 11:52 pm

Wikipedia has an article about the 1941 film. Are you surprised?

Wikipedia has an article about the 1931 film. Surely, you didn't expect this.
See, it's little stuff like this that makes even reading a post of links enjoyable. :up:
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by dreiser » Wed Aug 08, 2012 1:50 am

YouTookMyName wrote:Image
This was dreiser's avatar on a couple of occasions. The first time it appeared I was reading The Maltese Falcon and it clicked in my head as "a boyish face." I saved it for this essay.
Awesome. :D

I still owe you some commentary on the three films, Gort.
"I hate the dark, the sharks liars. And the stems of cherry..."

Like Someone in Love (Kiarostami, 2012) 4/10
Killing Them Softly (Dominik, 2012) 2/10
The Wonderful World of the Brothers Grimm (Pal/Levin, 1962) 6/10
The Dark Past (Mate', 1948) 7/10
New Rose Hotel (Ferrara, 1998) 3/10
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:35 am

dreiser wrote:
Awesome. :D

I still owe you some commentary on the three films, Gort.
Do you know the model's name, because she looks familiar, but I have no idea what her name is.

You'll get to that commentary at what I'm sure will be the perfectly right time, too.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by dreiser » Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:45 am

YouTookMyName wrote: Do you know the model's name, because she looks familiar, but I have no idea what her name is.
She's my favorite all-time supermodel: Linda Evangelista. Probably most famous for saying, "We don't wake up for less than $10,000 a day." Still gorgeous today.
"I hate the dark, the sharks liars. And the stems of cherry..."

Like Someone in Love (Kiarostami, 2012) 4/10
Killing Them Softly (Dominik, 2012) 2/10
The Wonderful World of the Brothers Grimm (Pal/Levin, 1962) 6/10
The Dark Past (Mate', 1948) 7/10
New Rose Hotel (Ferrara, 1998) 3/10
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 08, 2012 1:57 pm

A Comparison of
The Maltese Falcon (1931), Satan Met a Lady (1936) & The Maltese Falcon (1941)

Hammett's "Casper Gutman"
Image

We first meet Casper Gutman after 48% of the novel has unfolded, in Chapter 11 of 20. He dominates the rest of the book.

The fat man was flabbily fat with bulbous pink cheeks and lips and chins and neck, with a great soft egg of a belly that was all his torso, and pendant cones for arms and legs. As he advanced to meet Spade, all his bulbs rose and shook and fell separately with each step, in the manner of clustered soap-bubbles not yet released from the pipe through which they had been blown. His eyes, made small by fat puffs around them, were dark and sleek. Dark ringlets thinly covered his broad scalp. He wore a black cutaway coat, black vest, black satin Ascot tie holding a pinkish pearl, striped grey worsted trousers, and patent-leather shoes.
His voice was a throaty purr. "Ah, Mr. Spade," he said with enthusiasm and held out a hand like a fat pink star.


Two characters get killed in every version of The Maltese Falcon, but the Gutman character isn't one of them! Hammett may have been aware that Gutman in German would be Guttmann, which means "good man." Surely he was aware that the name Gutman has a relationship to the man being fat.

There is an implied sexual relationship between Gutman and his young body-guard, Wilmer Cook in the novel and in two of the films. More-so in the book than in the films, of course. Alison Skipworth's Madame Barabbas is possibly entangled with Kenneth, her young gunslinger, but that isn't strongly hinted at, other than the fact that he calls her "Auntie." Joel Cairo is also interested in Wilmer Cook in the novel, but not so much in any of the films. In the novel Gutman has a daughter Rhea who is peripherally involved in the plot about the Maltese falcon statuette. She appears in none of the films. But her presence makes Gutman a family man, or a former family man in the novel. Also it makes him someone who will involve his immediate family in his plots.

Dudley Digges, Alison Skipworth, and Sydney Greenstreet play increasingly accurate-to-the-novel versions of Hammett's Casper Gutman. Digges has the dialogue and attitude down correctly, except he makes Gutman someone who has never heard the term "fall guy," so he puts the emphasis on "guy" rather than on the first word. He is not portly enough to represent the fat man from the novel. Ultimately, he doesn't seem as red-fanged as the 1941 Gutman. Alison Skipworth is heavier than Digges, and she is more blood-thirsty in her role as Madame Barabbas, the Gutman counterpart in the middle film. But she has less screen-time than either Gutman actor, likely because Satan Met a Lady is a comedy.

But Sydney Greenstreet (in his first movie role at age 62) comes across as fat, and jovial, and delivers the lines with an apparent intimate understanding of the man's inner-workings. Of all the characters you'll ever see in any film, Kasper Gutman from the 1941 The Maltese Falcon is one of the best realized. Self-assured, wily, devious, single-mindedly obsessed, fat...Greenstreet projects all the aspects of Gutman that you get when reading the book. From the way he moves to the way he speaks, to his facial expressions, he is the Casper Gutman that Hammett writes of in the novel. Plus, in Huston's brilliant adaptation, no one character gets all the focus. The novel is told from the point of view of Samuel Spade, Private Operative, but he isn't really the main character. The novel is an ensemble story, with many important characters. Huston's film retains this Spade-centric perspective, but it becomes even more clear than it does with reading the novel, that a lot of characters are colliding in a most amazing way in this story. And Greenstreet almost steals the show from the rest of them!

Digges played Casper Gutman in his third film appearance, with 37 to follow before his death in 1947. Judging from his IMDb bio page he was mostly a character actor in his career. -- When Alison Skipworth was born in London, England, the United States was embroiled in a Civil War. She was 49 years old when she appeared in a 1912 short silent feature. By that time she had become a Broadway star, and perhaps was dabbling in this new medium. From 1920 until 1938 she worked very regularly in the cinema. When she played Madame Barabbas she was 73 years old, but had 16 years left on this earth. From 1938 until her death in 1952 she removed herself from the silver screen. She is best known as being the antagonist to W.C. Fields in three movies. -- Sydney Greenstreet was a successful actor (having grown bored with his prior career as a brewery manager) acting in both English and US productions, beginning in 1902. Greenstreet's movie career began with The Maltese Falcon, as I wrote above, but he worked steadily for the next 8 years in Hollywood. Greenstreet died in 1954 from complications of diabetes and Bright's Disease.


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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:06 pm

Wow. It has become clear to me over the past week that I may like The Maltese Falcon a bit too much. I still have 5 essays to finish and post. :shifty:
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Colonel Kurz » Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:22 pm

It's not even made of gold!
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 08, 2012 4:40 pm

Colonel Kurz wrote:
It's not even made of gold!
:D
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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 08, 2012 4:40 pm

A Comparison of
The Maltese Falcon (1931), Satan Met a Lady (1936) & The Maltese Falcon (1941)

Eroticism, Humor, Darkness
Image

The three films have decidedly different attitudes, or moods. The attitude is carried by not only the characterizations as performed by the cast, but by sound design, cinematography and set design. For example, the 1931 film is racy in a way that the 1941 film is not. The 1936 film is happy-go-lucky in a way that neither of the other films is. The 1941 film is lower key and darker in tone than the other two films. This is interesting, because all of them get underway when the Sam Spade character's partner is murdered!

Hammett's novel has a somewhat different mood. This is because you spend part of your time inside Sam Spade's head. You recognize in a way that none of the films quite gets across that Spade sees himself (rightly or wrongly) as only one Grand Jury call away from being indicted for the murder of a man he never met: Floyd Thursby. He has no proof that he didn't do this. Neither do the police. Not only that (and the films hint at this) those around him knowing of his romantic involvement with his partner's wife, see it as plausible that he killed Miles Archer in order to marry Iva! The book gets across, without ever saying it, that getting caught up in such a circumstance is exceedingly rare for a private operative. So Spade is where he has never been before. He doesn't like it and wants out. The basic plot of the book revolves around just how difficult getting out is getting to be as days drift by.

The films retain this urgency, even with their three discrete approaches: The Fulton-Holmes 1931 adaptation makes Spade out to be a womanizer who sees just one more opportunity to get laid in the person of his client, Ruth Wonderly. This gives it an erotic, racy ambiance that neither of the other films has to such a degree. Meanwhile, he has to somehow figure out what's going on with this woman, and her associates who become more and more bizarre, until he learns that they all have their eyes on what they believe to be an incredibly valuable object. One that they believe to be worth being deceptive, and even killing people in order to possess. So he quickly learns that he is not only in danger of being indicted for a murder or two, he may not live long enough to sit in front of the Grand Jury!

The Brown Holmes comic adaptation of 1936 puts Ted Shane in the position of being run out of town on a rail(road) by the city fathers. But he is a lovable rake, full of vigor and light-heartedness. He gets caught up the the same maelstrom, but he always seems to be in control, even if he doesn't look to be at the moment. I believe this impression stems from the character rarely making overt attempts to be in control. He more or less lets things happen, and then figures out how to respond. But he is in fact a calculating fellow, which becomes obvious at the end of the film. In fact, his willingness to use people for his own ends is waved in our faces in the very first scene of the movie, although it isn't quite so obvious at that time, since we don't know much about him. Valerie Purvis is the one who seems most controlling when we meet her. Indeed, she seems to put it over on Shane at the end...but in a most FAIL manner! From start to finish, despite a number of deaths, and much in the way of shenanigans, the film retains an everything-will-work-out attitude that fits comedy well.

John Huston's 1941 repeat focuses on the seediness of the enterprise, making the principles in the Falcon escapade seem potential cases for the mental hospitals of the era. The sets are cramped, and enclosed, and sometimes stifling in their confinement. The innards of all the characters magically spill out of them through great dialog and masterful performances, to the point that we feel their inward despair, at the same time that they look forward to triumph once they get their hands on The Maltese Falcon itself. We barely know any of them, but we get to learn who they are as the plot swiftly unfolds. We are allowed to learn something about even the most mysterious of them; and everything we learn fits together in a way things never do in real life. This creates the sense of inevitability that so enriches this version of Hammett's tale. It never quite becomes depressing, but it flirts with the possibility on several occasions.

I've written elsewhere that, given the time of creation of each movie, they all are well-made. Of course, Huston's version is supremely well-made. It's a case of all the things that were there cooking up together into a marvelous dish, that maybe even the cook didn't expect to be so delicious.

Perhaps each film embodies the spirit or attitude of its time. The cynicism of 1931 with an expected economic recovery not happening, and the hope of getting rich quick, but with an underlying skepticism that money alone would really solve all problems. And eventually the almost inevitable desire to view even harshness with a sense of humor, that may have developed after another 5 years of The Great Depression. Finally, the feeling that evil was afoot in the world in a way that was baffling, stubborn, and frightening that had developed by the third year of World War II, when the USA still was successful at remaining on the sidelines, but beginning to feel as if staying out was less and less possible.

It's the same story in all cases, but it is adapted to reflect the emotions and fears that drove people in 1931, 1936, and 1941. Hammett's original story is so universal that it can successfully be dressed in those wildly different moods, and still come across as good entertainment.


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"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 08, 2012 4:53 pm

Wikipedia has an article about the 1941 film. Are you surprised?

Wikipedia has an article about the 1931 film. Surely, you didn't expect this.
Hank wrote:See, it's little stuff like this that makes even reading a post of links enjoyable. :up:
I appreciate your affirmation, Hank.

No more lists for this Rematch, but four more essays. I hope some of them are beautiful walls of text. One of them, at least, will have some additional graphics to hang on the wall. :D
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 08, 2012 5:52 pm

Image

I'm not sure whether to add all these to noms. :D As the graphic says, The Blob is already nominated.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Colonel Kurz » Wed Aug 08, 2012 6:00 pm

The Gojira/Godzilla could be interesting because of all the cultural differences.
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Hank » Wed Aug 08, 2012 7:52 pm

In regards to Batman... it's so hard to know where it stops because they aren't so much remakes, as they are re-imaginings (or different visions (or versions for that matter)).

Also, would you be including this version of the Wizard of Oz?
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:00 pm

Hank wrote:In regards to Batman... it's so hard to know where it stops because they aren't so much remakes, as they are re-imaginings (or different visions (or versions for that matter)).

Also, would you be including this version of the Wizard of Oz?
Prolly. Although I've heard it isn't very good. Do you like it bunches? I guess I don't have to fully feature every possible version of any film. I'm trying to figure a way to do a Rematch without quite as much work as I've been having to put into each one. Even the 3:10 to Yuma that was supposed to be a "Weematch" took several weeks to accomplish. I guess I'm obsessively (and unecessarily) completist or something.

It would be nifty to devise a way to complete one a month.

As for reimaginings, I featured Planet of the Apes in a Rematch, and the second of those films is the grand-daddy of "reimaginings," since the first time I ever heard that term was in marketing for the film. I could feature the Batman serial, Batman the Movie, Batman, and Batman Begins. What I would examine is how alike and how different they are. In fact if any of those WB cartoon films is an origin movie it could fit in as a 5th version. In fact, since Batman the Movie isn't an origin story, and neither is the serial, actually, they don't even have to be origin tales.

I guess that's too much of a stretch.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by YouTookMyName » Thu Aug 09, 2012 3:04 pm

Another rather pointless post, I think. But not one without a purpose.

Does anyone care to know how I go about doing one of these Rematches? Probably not, but no one wanted Federal Express when it was merely an idea. So, I'll write it up and anyone interested can read about it. Writing this has helped me discover how I do these things, so that maybe I can plan a reasonable number of Rematches to add. I can tell you that I'll have only one Rematch working at a time from now on!

The Remake Rematch Process

Image

I'm using the 3:10 to Yuma rematch as an example because it was quick, and I made some graphics that might work if re-purposed here. :D This graphic is one created for the 3:10 to Yuma Weematch, as I called it, because of the reduced number of essays and tech posts I set for myself. It appears in the 2007 review without explanation. As I wrote this post I realized that I skipped two important steps when I made that graphic, but, of course, I wasn't making it for exactly the same purpose it's taken on here!

Step 0 was to decide whether I wanted to consider the Rematch. There's no graphic I could think of to represent that process. I guess I could have used my little brain icon.

ImageImageImage

I ordered the book and two DVDs through the local library system, and went to pick them up when they arrived at the requested branch.


Image

Step One was to read the source material. In this case (blessedly) a short story. I read it in order to decide whether I'd like to take the trouble for a Rematch scale project, because I wasn't sure. I liked the short story, and already had the two DVDs, so I watched them. That was all part of Step One, as a matter of fact. Read the source material (if I haven't read it already) and then see the movies made from it. I realized that I would like to make a Weematch from these films, so I went to Step Two.

Step Two was to watch the first film a second time, the original film adaptation of the short story, while scribbling a lot of notes by hand. Obviously, this required stopping and starting the film a lot.

Step Three was to watch the remake, again, while taking a lot of notes. All the viewings to this point were on my TV screen.

The Step with no Number At this point, in a step not noted in the top graphic, I decided on possible topics for the six essays I was allowing myself. I created the bbcode text file in which all the posts are always initially created and put together before I post to the board.
Image
I have to get some idea of what I want to write about to guide me in grabbing frames from each movie. So I scribbled down my ideas, and then selected what I thought I could do. I wrote out a note sheet to keep track of where I was (now marked up because the Weematch is complete) and put together the first post of the Weematch, which was the technical information post about where people could get copies of the films to watch. This was calculated to buy me some time to write essays and stuff, and make graphics for them. Then I went to the next steps.

Here's that top graphic again so you don't have to scroll up to keep track of where we are in it:

Image

Step Four shifted the base of DVD operations to the computer. I loaded up the original film DVD in VLC player and watched it a third time while grabbing many stills that I might use in creating graphics for the Weematch. About two hours and 1,373 vlcsnap files later, I was done with that step.

Step Five was to repeat the same process for the remake. In this case I pulled 2,379 frames from the longer film. But there's a lot of action in that movie, so in many cases I was grabbing stills as fast as I could press shift-s in order to try to get something usable out of a group of 5-10 grabs.

Image

Graphics Builds...Text Construction...Posting...Inserting Links
Another step, or set of steps, actually, without numbers. With the framegrabs complete, and the essays being written, I was able to create graphics as needed. Of course I sometimes have to turn to graphics that I can swipe from the internet in order to fill in. I usually do all the banner graphics for reviews and essay posts first. But the general procedure is basically write a text block--Photoshop--rewrite--test post in the Crew thread (with extra Photoshopping if the wall 'o words needs to be broken up and boldfaced subheads won't do the job)--and post to the Remake Rematch thread. It's at this point that I ignroe typos if necessary.

The review posts may or may not have been done at this time. I was able to work on everything, all the essays, the reviews, searching for internet sources, and so forth. The first essay post was about the scores, because it didn't need much in the way of extra graphics.

I needed quotations for one of the planned technical posts, and didn't find some of my favorites ready to copy and paste on the 'net, so I coupled pulling quotations with reviewing the films to refresh my memory of fine points for the essays.

Image

Step Six was to read the short story again and type up sections that I thought I might want to quote in further essays. Plus, I added to my hand-written notes and even wrote some sections of pending essays that were about the short story.

Step Seven had me watching the film again on the TV, making notes and scribbling down good quotes from the movie, plus I thought of points to make in the developing essays.

Step Eight was to repeat this process with the remake, and continue to tweak my ideas in writing.

Once those last viewings were completed I finished the graphics and essays that were still pending.

So, the Timeline Was...?
I started considering the Weematch in late March 2012, decided to do it on the 28th, and completed it on May 1st after dumping the final essay I had planned because it seemed to contain nothing that I hadn't said in other essays or the reviews. I already had it completely written, of course.

I didn't post anything to the Rematch thread until April 12th. The first essay went up April 21st. The reviews on the 24th and 28th. And then the rest of the posts afterward. The essays grew very long, because I was trying to include ideas that could have been broken into the usual 11-16 essays, but I was "limiting myself" so to speak. :roll:

I've Got to Be Careful!
I calculated the elapsed time I've spent on this thread since it began, in order to complete 9 Rematches (assuming completion of the Falcon Rematch by August 14th). It's been 555 days since I began the thread. That's an average of 61.6 days elapsed for each Rematch. But that doesn't include the time to design graphics from scratch for the entire thread, so it's the actual time for writing, grabbing frames and posting each rematch. Yet, that nine includes three Rematches that were already built in 2008, and I was mostly reposting those!

The Yuma Weematch took only 35 days, but the rest have taken more time. In fact, completing the pending ones has been running 4 hobby weeks apiece. So, with an average time of 8.8 weeks to do each one, and my only Weematch taking a little over half that, I figure estimating at least 6 weeks each is a safe minimum to plan with. For that reason I've got to be sure that I'm picking films that I can live with for that long. Any that I really dislike simply won't work for Rematches. A mild dislike, such as that for the Burton Apes flick or the 2008 remangle of The Day the Earth Stood Still is okay. I can stand that. :shifty:

If you read this far, I'm grateful. That's for both the thread and this post.
Gort/YTMN left the forum due to trolling on August 25, 2018.
I had fun. Thanks for reading!

"The wealthy and powerful always remind us that cream rises to the top.
What they fail to acknowledge is that pond scum also rises to the top.
And there is a lot more pond scum in the world than there is cream.
If you become rich and powerful, I hope that you will be cream rather than pond scum." --YTMN

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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by dreiser » Fri Aug 10, 2012 12:13 am

Wow. I knew this thread was time consuming, but yeesh. I tip my cap to you, sir.
"I hate the dark, the sharks liars. And the stems of cherry..."

Like Someone in Love (Kiarostami, 2012) 4/10
Killing Them Softly (Dominik, 2012) 2/10
The Wonderful World of the Brothers Grimm (Pal/Levin, 1962) 6/10
The Dark Past (Mate', 1948) 7/10
New Rose Hotel (Ferrara, 1998) 3/10
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Re: YTMN Presents a Remake Rematch Thread

Post by Das » Fri Aug 10, 2012 1:07 am

I read this thread pretty frequently, I rarely post in it enough though.I didn't know it was just that time consuming, also, a thousand plus caps per film? That's quite the commitment to quality control! Much respect to you.
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